Changing a ceiling light fixture - advice?

[RichyJ91]

Hello,

I have zero experience with electrics (sorry!). I want to install a pendant light fixture so that I can use a different bulb. The previous fixture had a 3-prong bayonet bulb which seems to be outdated now? When I’ve taken it off there seems to be more wires present than I have slots for, and the new fixture seems to have no where for the Earth wire. Any advice would be much appreciated.

It’s a landing light, with switches downstairs and upstairs, so I’m assuming that’s why there are extra wires? Photos are off the current wires, and new fixture.

Thanks.

 

[Geoff1946]

Did you take a picture with the original connections still intact? That's the one you need.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Hello,

I have zero experience with electrics (sorry!).... so I’m assuming that’s why there are extra wires?

Your assumption is incorrect....
The number of cables / wires at any light fitting depends upon the wiring arrangements and methods adopted by whoever originally installed it.


The basic problem that the majority of DIY'ers have when thinking that changing a light is just three wires,
is that they forget (or never knew), for a light to be able to switch on and off, (rather than being on permanently)..
somewhere there MUST connections for:-

Permanent Live.
Switched Live.
Neutral.
Earth.

These may all be at the light / at a switch / or at a junction box somewhere else..

Additionally if there are multiple lights on the circuit and/or worked from the same switch,
there could be additional connections extending these functions as well..

So BEFORE removing anything you need a clear understanding of how your particular set up is wired..

My guess from your photos are:-

one cable has Blue / Brown / Earth
these will be your Permanent Live + Neutral + Earth supply feed

another cable with Brown / Brown / Earth
these will be your Permanent Live + Switched Live + Earth going to the switch(es).

So you need the single Blue from cable 1 and single Brown from cable 2 into your light connections..
Then a separate connector for the other two Browns and another connector for the two Earths.

 

[RichyJ91]

This was the original set up, with the dark coloured wire being in the far left slot, next to the blue. I only remembered to take the photo after I took that one out.

When you say “connectors” do you mean some sort of neutralising box? As there is no where to plug them into the new fitting.

Thank you both for your replies.

 

[Fleeting]

Can you show the complete new fitting because if those wires are not correctly enclosed it may compromise the rating of it.

 

[Geoff1946]

Re - original photo. The two which are together, sharing a terminal, need to remain together. The other two are your light fitting connections.
I've just realised that the metal mounting plate is for your new fitting. As it doesn't appear to have an earth terminal your new fitting is presumably double insulated, which means that only double insulated cables, IE sheathed, should be in that enclosure.
Hence Fleeting's concerns above.
IMO the best way to deal with that is for all the original cables to be terminated in a junction box above the ceiling with just a twin sheathed brought down into that little box you picture.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

This was the original set up, with the dark coloured wire being in the far left slot, next to the blue. I only remembered to take the photo after I took that one out.

When you say “connectors” do you mean some sort of neutralising box? As there is no where to plug them into the new fitting.

Thank you both for your replies.

No idea what you are calling a neutralising box?

the old ceiling rose had 3 connections isolated from each other on the brass terminals in a row..
2x 3way, 1x 2way.
plus an earth termination toward the other side that looks like it has fallen out?

You still need 4 connections that are completely independent of each other...

[1] live from your cable joined to the live on the light fitting.
[2] neutral from your cable to the neutral on the light fitting.
{the above two are the outer connections on your old ceiling rose.}

[3] the permanent lives on your cables joined to each other but NOT the light fitting.
{these are the middle connections on your ceiling rose}}
[4] the two earths on your cables joined to each other and probably not the light fitting as it looks like a double insulated item.
{the missing edge terminal from you old ceiling rose}.


99% of modern light fittings very rarely have sufficient quantity or sized connectors for the average domestic UK wiring using any type of loop-in-out at the fitting.. They are mostly designed for a simple single cable in..

Which is why any half decent electrician carries a suitable selection of connectors in their normal stock and could swap this fitting for probably less than 30mins labour..

By the fact that you don't appear to know what to terminate the other wires into makes me think you have no electrical connectors of any type already in your possession?

which could be a waste of money if you have to by a packet / box of several when you only need 2.

Personally I would never recommend anyone with zero experience starts doing unsupervised electrical alterations..
as it is very easy to make something work.. but a bit more involved to ensure it is safe..

Seen far to many bodged DIY alterations in my time..
and unfortunately some do result in injuries, as electricity can kill a healthy adult in less than half a second.

Take care, but if you are still struggling its probably best to get someone competent to pop round..

As although the internet is ok for some guidance.. You CANNOT learn everything you need for every task..

and if there is any significant information omitted from your questions.. (that you didn't think was relevant)
then any answers could be lacking important detail.. that an electrician on site may spot straight away.

 

[RichyJ91]

Thank you everyone for your replies. In all honesty I only gave it a go as a previous electrician who visited said it’d probably be a simple swap (although he hadn’t actually seen in the fixture at the time). I’ve probably bitten off more than I can chew so will likely look at getting someone in to sort it.