practical test

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charlie

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Am new member so sorry if i'm going over similar threads.

Am taking the 2391 practical soon and would like as much info. as poss. on what to expect.

Am i right in saying you have to do a P.I.R. test ( not inspection ) on a 3 phase board feeding a number of ccts which include a 230v. board which also feeds a number of ccts ??

If so do you carry out all tests on the 3phase board and note results and then carry out tests on the 230v. board and note results. ??

Any info. will be appreciated which will help on this infamously nerve racking exam !!!

 

The Godfather

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Your instructor will advise you on this.

I can confirm the 3 phase tests are performed first, as the single phase board is a sub circuit of this.

Don

 

Nicky Tesla

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There was a db on my test with a number of faults already set up such as a 2.5 in a 30a mcb and an earth conductor with a few strands cut off to make it fit and t&e doubled up and clipped sideways on that sort of thing

 

ponyhorse

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on my test there was a visual inspection board with twelve faults on it

then a insulation resistance test on a consumer unit with various or no faults on it depending on switches

earth loop impedance test results were given to us then had to state whether this was acceptable

finally periodic inspection, full report filled out then examiner asks you to preform certain tests then once all testing is done sit down with regs book and complete periodic test report

 
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Welcome to the forum, Charlie.

""Am new member so sorry if i'm going over similar threads.

Makes no difference if it had made - it is still a fresh question by YOU. It can be answered again. (even if it has already been discussed).

 

extension15

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on my test there was a visual inspection board with twelve faults on it then a insulation resistance test on a consumer unit with various or no faults on it depending on switches

earth loop impedance test results were given to us then had to state whether this was acceptable

finally periodic inspection, full report filled out then examiner asks you to preform certain tests then once all testing is done sit down with regs book and complete periodic test report
I remember doing the inspection board.. :eek:

When doing the 2391 practical, a few of us ran out of time, but should competenceB)

So the instructor allowed us to come back FOC to complete..

The other sparky and I, sat discussing the inspection board, prior to the start of the exam, so we shared faults found on the inspection board and reached the magic 12 between us..

]:)

 
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Well been tryin to remember what we had to do???

there was a dead board with loads of incorrect wiring we had to identify and code.

e.g. and FCU with neon wired back to front so neon would always be on.

and wrong fuse in the the FCU. e.g 13a going to 1mm.

think there was a ES lamp holder with neutral wired to centre stud.

CPCs with no sheathing.

I have a feeling there was another board with a ring main with a broken leg & polarity reversal at one socket

and some circuits with artificially low Ins Resistance.

I think they could switch some of these faults in or out across conductor as required so the next candidate taking the practical didn't get the exact same faults as the previous one!

obviously there were the various live test reading as well to take & RCD times.

oh by the way

welcome M8:D:D

 

charlie

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Sounds like the full P.I.R. req's carrying out .So are you provided with the necessary info. i.e. original test certificate or previous P.I.R. 's and their scedule of test results which include supply characteristics etc which obviously help with filling in the practical P.I.R. for the test.

 

Apprenticespark

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i did a visual board with 12 faults, i found them in no time, simple stuff like sheathing stripped on the exterior of a accessory, wrong breaker covering a cct, poor bending radius, the minimum ip4x on a readily accesable horizontal surface breached, loose termination. Bread and butter stuff.

The second board is a insulation resistance test. The examiner will introduce different faults to cct's and you will have to record them as a low resistance fault of a short circuit fault.

Board 3 is a simple plug in efli test and interpretation of the results.

Board 4 is a full pir with 90 mins to do it. Mine had a 3 phase board with a sub to a single phase board, a ring, a 3phase motor cct up to a dol starter, a micc cct with a test point. You will have to move quick on this one or you will fall foul of time. I did my practical the day after my 2391 training was over so it was fresh in my head.

Stay cool during the test, but it does depend on your examiner. Some sparks i know say the examiner let them get on with it with little interest and passed them all - mine was watching like a hawk ready to fail. He failed 2 lads while i was doing my pir.

Glad i passed as i was nervous with someone watching over me. Good luck

 
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Sounds like the full P.I.R. req's carrying out .So are you provided with the necessary info. i.e. original test certificate or previous P.I.R. 's and their scedule of test results which include supply characteristics etc which obviously help with filling in the practical P.I.R. for the test.
I am sure that you are given any relevant information that would be required to assess your knowledge of individual aspect of PIR testing....

as I said earlier its been a few years ago I did mine..

the main things to remember are how to do each of the key electrical tests and record the results from those test..

once you have proved competence doing say Ins Res or RCD trip times on a simulated circuit...

there is no need to go and do the same tests on another half dozen circuits.

They need to know that you understand how to use the meters,

e.g. zero out leads, or note value of leads before doing R1+R2 or ring continuity readings

And how to record your results, (in the correct boxes on the cert, what sort of MCBs, breaking capacity etc..)

And understand if the results you have are acceptable or unacceptable.

expected disconnection times, max Zs... taking Highest RCD trip time @ 0 or 180deg'

etc..

etc..

It isn't as hard as it sounds..

just keep a systematic and logical approach..

I think at our college we could arrange to go in to do a bit of extra practical if we wanted to the week before the test....

best of luck m8... :)

 

charlie

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Thanks for all the feedback which helps but it does sound a bit of a nightmare on the nerves !!!!

Anyone can make a mistake with someone on their shoulder so is it failure on the first minor mistake or is some leeway given as long as it is not a dangerous mistake ??

 

norfolksparks

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visual fault board with 12 faults easy, insulation resistance test rig with variable faults that can be introduced by examiner, 3 phase board with 230 volt dist circuit, split board in two and work on each half at a time. A couple of other test rigs on which faults can be introduced. The smaller rigs are easy, make sure you concentrate on main board and don't make any stupid mistakes (Testing between phases with 230volt instrument = instant fail and fried test kit!). Have you taken the practical yet? I have photos of current city and guilds test rigs and close ups of the visual rig, these are the same throughout the country. Actually i won't share the photo's as they could drop me in hot water, not many places in my neck of the woods where you can take electrical exams, too easily identifiable!

 
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I think its instant failure if you make dangerous mistake ie if you forget to re-terminate main earth conductor back into earth bar after testing Ze and then you try to power up whole installation.

Other instant failure could be not following safe isolation procedure, locking off or leaving the key out of your pocket.

PS I havent done 2391 but completed L3 2330 last year and my tutor taught the 2391 course as well.

He used to nick the padlock keys from the lads tool trays and said "if we were doing 2391 exam he would fail us for that! and that the key must be kept on your person."

I think if your struggling to fault find they will give you a chance may be slight nudge & wink all depends on examiner.

 

steptoe

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the time i done mine, instructor/examiner actually pointed you slightly in direction cos there was prob about 30 faults on the board,

it had been abused so much.!!!!!

he was really more interested in your practical skills and method,

as has been said, your approach,

zero leads,

prove dead,

use correct box for readings,

etc.

oh, an obvious one to look for is a 6mm normal/roofing bolt for an earth tag,

it must be brass or copper, usually brass.

was something like 30%pass/70%fail at that time, across UK if Im to believe correctly, 7yr ago.

 

steptoe

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visual fault board with 12 faults easy, insulation resistance test rig with variable faults that can be introduced by examiner, 3 phase board with 230 volt dist circuit, split board in two and work on each half at a time. A couple of other test rigs on which faults can be introduced. The smaller rigs are easy, make sure you concentrate on main board and don't make any stupid mistakes (Testing between phases with 230volt instrument = instant fail and fried test kit!). Have you taken the practical yet? I have photos of current city and guilds test rigs and close ups of the visual rig, these are the same throughout the country. Actually i won't share the photo's as they could drop me in hot water, not many places in my neck of the woods where you can take electrical exams, too easily identifiable!
send them to me, I'll post them up, im not in the UK,

well not officially anyway, if i believe it, i dont even live in my own house cos i dont even exist at the mo,

wonder why they still tax a nobody then??????

 
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