Class of light for chandelier

[Blue Fox]

Hello,

Been reccomended by the guy I mentioned on here a couple of weeks ago who had no earth in his lights to his neighbour to do a consumer unit change. I'm guessing this house won't have an earth on its lights either! The other guy was quite reasonable and was happy to have a couple of his light fittings changed but this guy has a 20 year old chandelier that he says he paid a couple of hundered notes for 20 years ago and there is no way that is coming down!! The unit is a crystal chandelier with metal "arms" with bayonet fittings on for the lights. What class would you say this is? I'm thinking its a no go with no earth but what do you guys think? Don't want to waste my time testing the rest of his house if there is no chance of changing the c/u incase I then struggle to get paid for the testing!

 

[Andy™]

most likely class I

you can change a CU with lighting circuits without an earth, but everything should be class II

 

[batty]

Could be either class 1 or 2 If they are plastic lampholders then maybe class 2 but if brass then class 1 but a lot of old fittings don't comply with any regs. Over the years I have rewired and put new lampholders on a lot to bring them up to standard.

Batty

 

[Andy™]

depends if cable inside metallic parts is single or double insulated

 

[binky]

Option 1 - run an earth to fitting.

Option 2 - RCD protect circuit as recommended in one of NIC guides (last read during 16th edition by me) but as all new CUs are fully RCD protected, Bob's your uncle. Would double check the publication about changing CUs in properties without CPCs just in case I'm barking up the wrong tree again. Would say chandelier is class 1, but you can't force owner to change it so mark an a deviation on Certs (or add note to that effect) put warning sticker by CU amd instruct owner not change light bulb without isoalting circuit first (also put in this in writing)

 

[Andy™]

As binky says, but also remember that by changing CU and adding RCD, you have made the system safer than it was

 

[Evans Electric]

People who employ an electrician then ignore his advice are ( now,can't swear on here so) ... er .. silly billies . If the fitting has an earth tag and not marked up for double insulated , its Class 1. As I keep saying , we are not the Electric Police, so change the C/U and note the unearthed fitting in the appropriate box, take the money and move on but don't lose your copy of the cert. I understand Binkys comment on advising client to switch off before re-lamping but that would be forgotten before you had started your van. Advise him in writing using the cert, if he dos'nt read it he has ignored you twice, you have done all you can.

Deke

Sorry Binks , you said that too , did'nt notice it before. Blushing

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Hello,Been reccomended by the guy I mentioned on here a couple of weeks ago who had no earth in his lights to his neighbour to do a consumer unit change. I'm guessing this house won't have an earth on its lights either! The other guy was quite reasonable and was happy to have a couple of his light fittings changed but this guy has a 20 year old chandelier that he says he paid a couple of hundered notes for 20 years ago and there is no way that is coming down!! The unit is a crystal chandelier with metal "arms" with bayonet fittings on for the lights. What class would you say this is? I'm thinking its a no go with no earth but what do you guys think? Don't want to waste my time testing the rest of his house if there is no chance of changing the c/u incase I then struggle to get paid for the testing!

Hello Blue

Light fitting is 99% sure to be classI IMO:|

I think the following points may help you choose how to approach this job..

basically confirming what most of the other guys have said already..Guiness Drink

but IMHO putting it in a logical step guideline..

1] You can only do the work a customer asks you to do. You cannot insist they pay you to do other stuff.

2] It is perfectly normal for customers of limited income to want to progress electrical improvement work in stages rather than a full rewire in one go.

3] Organising improvement work in stages say room-by-room OR circuit-by-circuit OR floor-by-floor, are all logical approaches.

4] If doing work by stages the sensible first place to start is upgrading the CU.

5] If main bonding is not present this should be included with the first stage of work.

6] Any hazards noted during any of the work, (just as with a PIR), should be notified to the customer, preferably in writing ASAP.

for example if I found an unearthed ClassI light fitting or accessory whilst undertaking some work. I would probably give the customer a letter something like:-

Dear customer Whilst undertaking the recent electrical alterations at your property, as detailed on certificate serial number xxyyzz, dated dd/mm/yy.

I noted there was an unearthed ClassI fitting in the "roomname". To comply with current wiring regulations this should either be; replace with a ClassII fitting or the circuit wiring modified to include an earth (cpc) conductor.

Due to an increased risk of electric shock from this unearthed fitting, I recommend you organise remedial work at your earliest convenience and avoid touching this fitting whilst it is switched on.

Regards

Your local electric co.

HTH

Guiness Drink

 

[Andy™]

Dear customerWhilst undertaking the recent electrical alterations at your property, as detailed on certificate serial number xxyyzz, dated dd/mm/yy.

I noted there was an unearthed ClassI fitting in the "roomname". To comply with current wiring regulations this should either be; replace with a ClassII fitting or the circuit wiring modified to include an earth (cpc) conductor.

Due to an increased risk of electric shock from this unearthed fitting, I recommend you organise remedial work at your earliest convenience and avoid touching this fitting whilst it is switched on.

Regards

Your local electric co.

i would change that to 'at all times unless power turned off in consumer unit'. dont forget there is probably a permanent live there, and if the fault is with that, fitting will always be live.

 

[batty]

i would change that to 'at all times unless power turned off in consumer unit'. dont forget there is probably a permanent live there, and if the fault is with that, fitting will always be live.

Changing the subject I had a damp wall today at 224 volts.

Batty

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Changing the subject I had a damp wall today at 224 volts.Batty

:^O :^O:^O

I do wish you would use the toilet!!!! ] :OGuiness Drink

 

[batty]

:^O :^O:^OI do wish you would use the toilet!!!! ] :OGuiness Drink

What are you sayiing specs its not friday night.

?:|

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

i would change that to 'at all times unless power turned off in consumer unit'. dont forget there is probably a permanent live there, and if the fault is with that, fitting will always be live.

Good point....Applaud SmileyGuiness Drink

had a lounge metal fitting once that had just been twisted wires wrapped in selotape... :_|

tape had fell off just bare dangly wires, fortunately they hadn't touched anything..

But the potential was there for fried fingers!!!

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

What are you sayiing specs its not friday night. ?:|

You and your "damp walls"?

we all know what causes them? ; \ ]

 

[batty]

Good point....Applaud SmileyGuiness Drinkhad a lounge metal fitting once that had just been twisted wires wrapped in selotape... :_|

tape had fell off just bare dangly wires, fortunately they hadn't touched anything..

But the potential was there for fried fingers!!!

My worst one was a customer had put fitting up himself and used earth point for loop wires glad I had put circuit breaker off before I had touched it.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

My worst one was a customer had put fitting up himself and used earth point for loop wires glad I had put circuit breaker off before I had touched it.

Applaud Smiley:O:^O:^O

spare connector...

why cant I use it to stuff these other wires in????Blushing

 

[batty]

Applaud Smiley:O:^O:^Ospare connector...

why cant I use it to stuff these other wires in????Blushing

And he said that was what was on the instructions, Yeh right.

:^O

 

[Andy™]

And he said that was what was on the instructions, Yeh right. :^O

it is. doesnt the 'E' mean 'Extra' cables that he found, like the permanent live?!