Finding the correct cIrcuit

[m4tty]

Hi,

I recently done some work for an electrician who has the maintenance contract for a big cash and carry.

I'll cut to the chase. Been asked to replace a few single sockets for doubles in the bakery. They are outdoor mk masterseal I think.

This place is much bigger than anything I've ever had to do with and the guy I'm working for is my best contact ATM. He's teaching me loads so I'm happy but he's old school.

I asked him how to find out where to isolate the bakery sockets from. He showed me the boards upstairs and there's loads of boards and hundreds of circuits. He said the way to find out what circuit it was on was to short it out and go see which breaker has tripped. Test for dead. Do work then go and reset.

I know your probably gonna crucify me for this suggestion but what would be the best/safest way to do it. The socket is quite a way from the boards.

If anyone could suggest a good way around this as none of the boards are marked up.

Thanks in advance

 

[ElectekAir]

get one of those tester thingies

Dont know the exact name of them but you plug a remote into the socket then go to the fuse board with a different remote and it beeps when you get to the correct breaker

 

[Doc Hudson]

I think a circuit tracer with tone generator and handheld receiver unit would be a better solution than shorting out the a cables.

Doc H.

 

[ElectekAir]

I think a circuit tracer with tone generator and handheld receiver unit would be a better solution than shorting out the a cables.Doc H.

That is what i meant to say:worship

 

[Doc Hudson]

ElectekAir beat me to it.

Doc H.

 

[Sidewinder]

"Heck" M4tty that is dodgy, but, effective!

There are circuit tracers but they can be a pain and not very accurate.

A "correct way" would be to say put a socket tester in the socket have someone there with a 2 way radio & someone at the board switching breakers off until the socket went off!

Then prove, test, LOTO, etc.

IF you do the "short it" bit, and I'm not endorsing it, remember I've taken the 6" nails out of my fault finding kit, I'm just arranging a burial with full honours as I write, or you use any other method, please LOTO after to stay safe, I'd hate to loose our Looney Aprentice.

; )

 

[Doc Hudson]

I am sure someone will post up a link, Megger Mark will no doubt have something at his site?

Doc H.

 

[m4tty]

I'll have a butchers on meggermarks site then thanks

 

[Sidewinder]

I'm just TOOOOOOOOOOOO slow tonight.

I have one of those tone things, a Martindale, it's carp as it "sends" the signal down all lives of the same phase thus say all reds show as connected through the DB bus bars.

Any better ones out there, I've had mine over 10 years so they may have improved?

 

[Andy™]

whilst shorting L-N isnt a good idea, ive seen it done a few times. but it can go horribly wrong is someone has changed MCB to higher rating or something. if everything is RCBO'd, you could always short N-E. almost guaranteed to trip. or do a loop test on high setting.

but back in the 'safe isolation' world, circuit lists would be best some kind of MCB finder would be second best. otherwise start flicking thru breakers (where possible) until you find circuit

sometimes the biggest challenge is finding the DB.

there is a place i do work for has about 12 SP boards and a few TP accross 3 floors.

most of the 2nd floor is fed from ground floor DB's, and 1st floor from the same floor. and sometimes you pass a DB and go further away to get to where its switched from

 

[Larnacaman]

The correct way to find the right breaker amongst as you say hundreds of breakers is by using one of these or something similar... http://isswww.co.uk/Cable-Locators-Wire-sorters/Fluke/Fluke-2042-Cable-Locator/

 

[Sidewinder]

This is the one I have.

I'm not happy with it!

http://old.isswww.co.uk/Fuse-Finders/Martindale/Martindale-FD600-Professional-Fuse-Finder-Kit/

 

[Andy™]

or you could always do as DNO do... fire a pin/other into the cable. if it wasnt dead, it will be, and if it was dead, then its proved

 

[m4tty]

Thanks for all the replies onthis thread everyone. No rcds in this place or rcbos

Cheers

 

[Evans Electric]

When you say " old school" Matty , he must be even older than me to suggest shorting it out , last time I heard that one was in the sixties . Its actually a most stupid suggestion TBH .

As said above , theres the tracers but I don't hear the best reports of them .

I had a plastic adaptable box for years , with a bell and a light in it with a flex and plug .

Run extension lead up the building and plug in where you can hear or see it, then start yanking them out . Warnings to the staff of course ,computers etc, or out of hours work ,tracing and marking boards up .

There are loads of places like that , nightmare!!!

A method we used last year at some offices was to clip the ammeter on the circuit at the board then using walkie talkies one of us goes to the floor and plugs in a 2KW fan heater w2hile the other looks for the reading to change.

Worked a treat.

 

[spinlondon]

I used to work with a guy at a factory, who had a load of different plugs made up for this. I think he just shorted out the line and earth on them all, as some of our circuits were three phase and didn't have neutrals.

The largest plug he had was 63A three phase.

 

[Andy™]

Its actually a most stupid suggestion TBH . .

best stay away from LL for a while then Deke....

 

[Evans Electric]

LL ?? You lost me there Andy.

 

[Andy™]

secret place where TOTD is?

 

[Evans Electric]

Ah! :Blushing :coat