New to it, looking for advice. Thank you,

[2021]

Good Morning Ladies and Gents, (0433hrs on the night shift)

Hi, I am about to start out on my endeavour to qualify as an electrician.  I've considered many different trades and drilled down into the pro's and con's of many and decided that electrician is the one I shall commit too.  I find it all very interesting and realised that it's a field where everyday is a learning day which I like and the whole electrical field really interests me.

A bit about me, which may help understand my reasons of why electrical:  age 44, male, healthy and fit, 15 yrs Infantry Soldier, currently in my 5th year working in Military Detention (Colchester Glasshouse) out the Military in aprox 26 Months.  I know I am starting late but I am diligent, motivated and have a strong professional work ethic which I hope will see me achieve my ambition of being an electrician.  I have a healthy respect for electricity as a remember vividly being about 8 years old and fishing about under the bed for a toy or something and the wall socket was hanging off, little fingers decided to poke around and I remember getting thrown clear across the room and banging my head on a sink!  Not particularly safe considering it was a care home, but I guess regulations and safety wasn't such a concern back then (chuckle).  But with that in mind, I'm keen to be a good electrician - I don't fancy another treat like that! Nor would I like any work i do resulting in anyone else getting one so I have to get it right.

I am starting out late!!  I am nearly 44 and so far I have zero qualifications in electrical science and no practical experience.  After deciding on being an electrician about 18 months ago I have so far just been quite casual in reading about the subject and looking into a few websites just general reading to learn the lingo.  About 12 months ago I went to Screwfix and spent £100 on wires, wire strippers, plugs, sockets, light fittings, RCB's and bits and various pieces (just all the cheapest stuff they had) which I take out now and again and just get a 'feel' for handling and working with the components of the trade, at the most basic level.  I was quite surprised at how many considerations there are to assess with things like wire diameter and loads.  (I've never ran any current through anything, no chance, just experimenting with some kit in 'dry rehearsals')

I am still employed full time I will be doing a lot of self study and going in for practical training (I'll carry on self training outside of the workshop environment), I have 26 months to get to a point where I can hopefully earn enough money to live and provide for my child (I have a shared residency and being an electrician means I can move to find work if the ex gets difficult in the future (groan) I've already covered 30 000 miles in last 14 months keeping my boy smiling but I'm going to be much closer once I've left the Armed Services, but also unemployed... 

I have been looking around at training options etc... my questions are:

Are AbleSkills and TradeSkills4U any good? 

What qualifications should I realistically hope to achieve in these 26 months to get me moving towards being able to earn money?

Is there a specific aspect of the electrical industry that I should focus on?  I'm no spring chicken so was hoping to avoid wasting time studying areas that I don't need in the early stages, like 3 phase, do I need to learn that inside out at the start?  

I'm not monetary driven, not looking to be on big bucks I just need to be able to earn enough to live and provide opportunity for the little one + doing a job which I respect and interests me.

Ladies, gents knowing what you know what should I do? 

Bit of a long intro but hoped to build a picture of where I am at, time frames and where I want to finish up.

I appreciate any advice, sincere thanks to any steers in the right direction, and all the best!

 

[Sharpend]

Don’t the armed force personnel get assistance from army etc for retraining? 

I’d seek this assistance then get registered at local college for the ‘proper’ C&G qualifications. It will mean starting at the bottom, after all that’s where you’re at, but within 26 months you should get a decent amount of training and qualifications that actually represent a worth.  

If you do some digging around on the two training providers (and there are others) you mention you will soon realise that they aren’t what they make themselves to be, more a wolf in sheeps clothing. 

Stick to the more traditional prescribed training methods and you will become a better more rounded electrician not a hopeful chancer. 

Best of luck, and welcome to the friendliest forum. 

 

[Doc Hudson]

Are AbleSkills and TradeSkills4U any good? 

What qualifications should I realistically hope to achieve in these 26 months to get me moving towards being able to earn money?

Is there a specific aspect of the electrical industry that I should focus on?  I'm no spring chicken so was hoping to avoid wasting time studying areas that I don't need in the early stages, like 3 phase, do I need to learn that inside out at the start?  

There are numerous organisations providing a broad spectrum courses to meet requirements for wide range of skills, from new starters to top-up of latest amendments. Your problem will be to ensure your not miss sold a wrong package that will leave you out of pocket and not competent enough to earn the living you are aiming for. Far to frequently we see new starters who have been sold a "top-up" regulations course thinking they will come out of it as an employable commodity. In my opinion there are three basic areas of knowledge you will need to get under your belt.

[1] The Science stuff: The laws of physics, how electrical current passes along a conductor to supply a load have not changed. Fundamental methods for generating and supplying electricity hasn't changed much. Newer locally generated green energy, has brought changes to the possible sources of power and the direction it flows between installation and supply grid.  A clear understanding about how many, and what types of sources of power an installation has. Plus its earth arrangements, along with all the normal design calculations for each circuit to fail safe during a fault, without endangering people, property or livestock are the essential backbone of an electricians knowledge.

[2] The practical workmanship stuff: Selecting and erecting cables and accessories and understanding about building structures is an area that changes as materials and technologies progress. There are always multiple ways a circuit can be installed, but when selecting cables and protective devices factors including; safety, cost, visual appearance to meet customers preferences all have to be taken into consideration. Some of this can only be learnt on the job. Hence why traditional apprenticeships are not a "short course" 

[3] Laws and Regulations: Some regulations are statutory such as Health & Safety, Building regulations  etc. whereas wiring regulations are non statutory. All types of laws and regulations can be amended over time, and anyone undertaking electrical work for monetary gain should be up-to-date with all relevant laws & regulations. This bit is very easy for training providers to sell and get bums-on-seats to pass, and boost their performance statistics.

Some of the shorter courses tend to skip over the fundamental science and calculations and just concentrate of teaching wiring regulations and building regulations, as they are designed for those already in the trade just needing to bring the qualifications up to date with the latest edition of BS7671. In my opinion you cannot skip bits out of the electrical science aspect, as although our domestic properties may only utilise a single phase from the supply, if you don't understand where that single phase supply has come from, you will not appreciate some of the dangers if supply conductors are broken or inappropriate sized earth conductors are installed. You need to get the basics clear if you are going to be a success.

As I mentioned, we get far to many mid-life career changers posting on the forum, thinking they will be recognised as an electrician when all they have is a certificate saying they have passed a wiring regs exam, and have being taught how to wire up 3 sockets, a fused spur and a two way light on a bit of wood with a mix of flat T&E and PVC conduit. But have no idea about how to actually calculate anything from cable sizes to diversity. Or if ever they encounter a fault they have no idea about what the readings on their test meter actually mean or the difference between Insulation resistance tests and continuity tests etc.. 

Doc H. 

 

[Evans Electric]

:Welcome: As the Doc said ,  we get many  older & middle aged guys  who want to be electricians .   There are are many threads on hear on the subject and we do try to help . 

The trade has changed ,   many  members on here  did the traditional apprenticeship  from leaving school ,  working with an electrical firm and doing City & Guilds on day or block release.          Those apprenticeships are few & far between these days  and most newcomers to the trade  are like yourself  .  

Drawing from  recent threads we've had on this  I'd offer the following advice  ...some of the guys may improve on it ..watch this space. !

The trade teaching companies I'm somewhat dubious about to be honest .

Your ideal  plan , given your situation is :-

 (1)  Get a job as an Electrician's Mate  (or Adult Mate)   (( You could register  with the JIB  as this grade))  .  This is the only way you'll learn the practical skills  In my opinion

(2)   Start the various City & Guilds at  YOUR LOCAL COLLEGE  .    ( Someone will tell you what they are  , I'm not up to date on that) 

(3)   One qualification requires you to be working within the trade , learning practical skills  I think its this NVQ thing) 

(4)  I believe there is also a Domestic Installer course   ( Referred to here as  ...The 5 Week Wonder Scheme )    I promise you , after the 5 weeks  you will still be a million miles away from  being an electrician .  

May I suggest you get hold of a Regs book  ( IEE  Electrical Regulations )  Try  ebay etc  for an old version  .... 15th..16th edition ...17th edition .. should be cheap now as they are obsolete .  Reading that will give you an idea  ....   bit like the QR's  perhaps .   Some of it never changes but remember ...its an old edition .

Plumbing could be an easier course .

Building  .... just write BUILDER on your van  and your there !!!  :C  

Stick with us and let us know how you get on .

edit :   Just seen on ebay   ....copy of the  17th edition   ( Red cover)    for £4.00    

 

[2021]

Thank you Gents,

@Sharpend: The Army do have resettlement packages but they have a sole purpose of being in place to guide Service leavers who don't have any idea what they want to do post Service.  At least that's my opinion on them, as in they are there to show that Ex Forces are given resettlement opportunities (CV Writing, Course Providers etc) but their Business Model if you like is very generic and needs to encompass the whole spectrum of employment options that people may wish to go into so I figure if I want specific experienced guidance this would be a better place for me to be better tutored by SME's (Subject Matter Experts) rather than general career advisers.  Service people do qualify for some financial assistance with training costs though and I want to make sure I don't waste mine as I'm not exactly rolling in it (ever heard the joke about 'what have hurricanes and women got in common? lol).  And yes I'd much rather get enrolled in a local college and do things that way, ideal, but I've looked into all options on that front it's it's just not possible due to my work commitments so I've got to look outside of that option to make any progress moving forward.  Thank you for responding and I've taken note of being aware of training providers and making sure they are not going to take my cash and deliver empty boxes.

@Doc Hudson: So much excellent food for thought!  Really good stuff and actually gives me more confidence as it's all the science and calculations which I am interested in.  When I first decided to train in this I looked at the light switch in the office and as I'd never really thought about it before I asked myself the question "right then, so what the f**k is going on in there?!" ended up spending a few days researching and learning to understand how it is generated at power stations (fossil or renewable) then sent via step-up transformers to step-down sub stations then distributed and now I appreciate the work going on behind me flicking on the kettle much more! (lol) And the whole DC/AC Sine Waves and all that good kit is really interesting, I can't make much sense of it right now but I'm like the tide coming in and very difficult to stop (lol) I'll keep going until I understand.  Thank you so much for taking the time and posting that stuff - very appreciated!

@Evans Electric: Thank you for the Welcome EE and many thanks for the solid food for thought in your post. 

"(1)  Get a job as an Electrician's Mate  (or Adult Mate)   (( You could register  with the JIB  as this grade))  .  This is the only way you'll learn the practical skills  In my opinion" 

This is not something I can do due to my work, I cannot offer any reliability to them as my work can be can quite random and dominate my life.  BUT.... we do have REME (Royal Electrical Mechanical Engineers) Units inside the wire so if I take over some coffee and biscuits when have an hour the blokes there will let me get my hands dirty and get a feel for some aspects of the trade which I suppose can't be far removed from the real world.  I'll just go over and hang around when I'm off duty and sweep the stores out for them or something in return for educating me on bits and pieces - One Team One Fight and all that good stuff!  (Unless they're d**ks, but unlikely)

"(2)   Start the various City & Guilds at  YOUR LOCAL COLLEGE  .    ( Someone will tell you what they are  , I'm not up to date on that)"

I replied to Sharpend above on this too, the problem I've got is time, location, availability in conflict with my current employment and personal responsibilities so it's just not an option I can beat my head against the wall for ever on this I'll never get through it.  But, I am quite comfortable on self teaching by doing a home study course, I'd probably get along faster than what i would if in a classroom; I wouldn't have much to do to be a fully qualified teacher as it is, I have 18 years Instructor/Mentor/Coach/Teaching.  It's in entirely different subject area but the principles of teaching and accelerated learning are the same, don't get me wrong I'm no show me once I understand it type but when I get a passion for something I go all in and don't quit.  I'm comfortable with home study option and going into a centre for concentrated practical experience (I'll do a lot more in my own time at home) and their exam papers.

"(3)   One qualification requires you to be working within the trade , learning practical skills  I think its this NVQ thing)"

Yes, it's the difference between Academic and Vocational.  I can achieve the Theory (Academic) via home study and giving myself Formative testing then go into a centre for Summative testing but even if I pass the Summative assessment the reality is I'm untested and still know s**t when it comes to applying it 'in the field' so to speak.  I've seen many new soldiers take all the notes, learn all the characteristics of the various grenades we use but once they out in the field and it's live grenade range day all that theory means fe*k all once they've pulled the pin and it's real time on the job, only exposure and experience grows the confidence and ability.  Same logic must apply to most things and let's face it.... understanding and using grenades is a lot simpler than electrical science and being a competent electrician.  

"(4)  I believe there is also a Domestic Installer course   ( Referred to here as  ...The 5 Week Wonder Scheme )    I promise you , after the 5 weeks  you will still be a million miles away from  being an electrician ."

Roger that, I've looked at those courses and being teacher qualified myself and having scratched the surface of electrical science I can appreciate that they are offering a scallop shell with no scallop inside.  I wouldn't be confident at all doing one of those courses and tipping up to a job, if they were cheaper I'd do one just for a general interest taster course but not expecting to be able to bring any competent person value to a job.  Classroom based experience is sterile the real world is messy and variable.

"May I suggest you get hold of a Regs book  ( IEE  Electrical Regulations )  Try  ebay etc  for an old version  .... 15th..16th edition ...17th edition .. should be cheap now as they are obsolete .  Reading that will give you an idea  ....   bit like the QR's  perhaps .   Some of it never changes but remember ...its an old edition ."

On the same page mate, I bought some off ebay months ago to flick through and it all made absolutely no sense to me (lol) but I'm nearing crunch time in 26 months so I'm going to put together a study timetable and start digging through them in a more structured way.  I've recently bought the IET Code of Practise for In-service Inspection and Testing of Electrical Equipment (4th Edition) think I paid £38 for it.  I'm just drilling through that on my night shifts at the moment just to build up a thin layer of knowledge on the subject.

"Plumbing could be an easier course"  Agreed, I think it would be easier and I wish I was interested in it but it just doesn't hold any appeal for me, I know there are more course providers in this trade for resettlement but I can't see the point in going in a direction that I know I'm going to get bored of very quickly.  What i do next is going to be my second career and I want it to be one that i wake up and look forward to ya know.

"Building  .... just write BUILDER on your van  and your there !!!"  (lol) I think there's some tradesman banter going on there and I'm not in any position to comment. I imagine brick laying and digging foundations to be on par with digging a defensive trench or bulling boots for a Queens Birthday Parade... as boring as listening to politicians lie but at least only a few times a year not day in day out  

"Stick with us and let us know how you get on"  I will do, I'll be coming here for advice and guidance and it is very appreciated - thank you!

So... the theme is that I need that classroom based learning over time and practical hands on there are no short cut quick routes or I'll not be credible and in a nutshell a cowboy trader.  Fortunately I've got the teaching experience in my ammo pouch so my next step is to get enrolled on a distance learning Electrical Science Level 2 as my foundation and get involved with getting as much exposure to the trade as I can find.  I was umming and arring a bit but this interaction has really cleared away the question marks and fog and I can commit to my start point.

So the level 2 is going to cost £2500 and all in all at the end of it it's going to have cost me about £8000 to be a fully qualified Electrician in Domestic and Commercial settings and take about 3-5 years but needing to be in a position where I can earn some money in 26 months.  I may step sideways into PV but I'll be here asking for advice about that later on, not going to jump the gun, need to get my teeth into the Level 2 and see how it goes, possibly starting in mid/late October once pennies are available.   I have my clear objective so now it's just a question of effort.

Thank you all very much for your advice and taking the time to help me out!

 

[Doc Hudson]

Glad we have been of some help. this is basically what the forum is all about. As long as people are open and honest about what they know or don't know, and what they are aiming for, then you will normally get a reasonable amount of feedback to chew over. But when people pretend to be something that clearly they are not, asking for advice on how to do something that is obviously way above their ability and potentially dangerous to both them and anyone using what they propose to wire up then people don't always get the answer they were expecting.  So keep your expectations grounded in reality, as and when you need more help, come back for more info and try to give us a many relevant facts as possible to give all members a chance to post stuff that is applicable to your situation.

Doc H.