non registered self cert electrician and building control

Talk Electrician Forum

Help Support Talk Electrician Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

paulh

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 4, 2008
Messages
144
Reaction score
0
Hello All,

Long time since I was here!!

I have been asked by someone to do some electrical work in their kitchen. I am a electrician but not registered with a scam provider. I applied for permission which was given but the letter says:

BS7671 issued by a competent electrician registered with an electrical self certification scheme?

So they have taken my money for building consent but still want a scam provider to issue the certs? Have I missed something here or are the council wrong. I am competant with the certs to prove this and have been a practicing spark for over 30 years, but dont do enough domestic installs to warrant joining a part P scheme..help

 
Council are wrong. They are trying to push their responcibility onto you. I would suggest talking to them.

 
I have just been looking through the part P document again and it clearly states that if you are an electrician and competent you can do the install. Bloody councils, I guess I will need to have a barney with them tomorrow. I am all for protecting the general public but hey give us a break!!

 
I had a similar argument in the past with our council.

They said they did a reduced rate notification fee (around

 
Before Part P came about some councils had an approved electrician list. To be on this list you had to provide your certificates, these were then kept on file. I still get reminders from the council to update my details even though Part P now negates my requirement to issue my details to the council directly. The most recent request was for me to provide the new 17th edition certificate for me to remain on the list. I do know that some councils will except certificates from people who are not on any Part P scheme providing your details are verified. However you would still have to notify the work before you start, and they may, and have the right, to independantly test the installation before a building compliance is issued.

I decided to register under the Part P scheme, only to avoid the possible red tape and extra costs.

 
Hello All,Long time since I was here!!

I have been asked by someone to do some electrical work in their kitchen. I am a electrician but not registered with a scam provider. I applied for permission which was given but the letter says:

BS7671 issued by a competent electrician registered with an electrical self certification scheme?

So they have taken my money for building consent but still want a scam provider to issue the certs? Have I missed something here or are the council wrong. I am competant with the certs to prove this and have been a practicing spark for over 30 years, but dont do enough domestic installs to warrant joining a part P scheme..help
Another reason why the UK needs a National Register of Qualified Electricians, to replace these totally profit based Scam Providers.

It will also go a long way in ridding the industry of ''jack the lad'' unqualified jokers that are a danger to the general public ....and themselves!!!

 
sorry to go of track abit but just your thoughts on a jib card registration as i am thinking of applying for it

moose man

 
I did mine so that I can get a CRB check through the JIB, as for the self employed / family run business it is difficult to get CRB checks done.

Costs are reasonable with them too.

Local Authority work in schools requires it in our area.

 
Paulh , is this kitchen work under building control, as in, a building inspector will be calling to inspect footings , K glass ,etc ?

Or is it just Mr & Mrs Smith having a kitchen refurb . You see where this is going .

 
The building inspector was already dealing with the building aspect of the extension where I was working when he looked at my first fix and gave the thumbs up for the walls to be plastered, ceilings to go up. He doesn't want to see it again until it's all up and running and certs have been done.

 
Its just a kitchen refurb. ie: new kitchen ring,lights and new cu.

 
Its just a kitchen refurb. ie: new kitchen ring,lights and new cu.
In that case then either a Part P registered electrician has to do the work or anyone else provided they inform the LABC 48 hours before commencing the work & pay the appropriate fee. If you think thats hard, how do you think all of us that do pay to be registered feel ?

---------- Post Auto-Merged at 21:17 ---------- Previous post was made at 21:15 ----------

Can you elaborate us as to what permission you were given ? The reply you have quoted does not make sense.

 
Sorry if I don't make sense slips. I do not think this is hard and expected to pay for the councils part as I come under the "anyone else" catogory as I am not registered with a part P scheme. I am however a spark who runs his own limited company but normally work in the industrial/commercial sector not domestic. I have got building consent but the council have added a sentence to the compentant part, this is the offending sentence in their letter. I quote "BS7671 issued by a competent electrician registered with an electrical self certification scheme".

 
"BS7671 issued by a competent electrician registered with an electrical self certification scheme".
That does not make sense. I assume they mean they will accept an installation certificate stating the works meet BS7671 if supplied by a electrician registered with an self certification scheme.

I have had LABC accept my certs and sign off a job before i have notified them many times, & thats wrong. My first comment still stands that 'anyone' could do the work as long as 48 hours notice is given before the works start and a fee is paid.

---------- Post Auto-Merged at 01:27 ---------- Previous post was made at 01:21 ----------

A short while after part P started the ODPM had to issue a letter to all building controls stating any testing & fees were included in their fees and could not charge more. This office is no longer but i am sure the rules still stand

Found it, heres the relevant bit

Local authority inspection and testing of electrical installation work in dwellings.

Where electrical installation work in dwellings is carried out by an installer registered with an authorised Part P competent person scheme (see Schedule 2A of the Building Regulations 2000, as amended), there is no requirement to submit a building notice or full plans to the local authority. Regulation 16A authorises the local authority to accept a certificate from the person carrying out the work as evidence that the requirements of Regulations 4 and 7 have been satisfied.

Where, however, notifiable electrical installation work is to be carried out by a person not registered with a Part P competent person scheme, a building notice or full plans must be submitted to the local authority. Under section 91 of the Building Act 1984 local authorities are then under a duty to enforce the relevant building regulations in their areas. Regulation 18 allows local authorities to make such tests as may be necessary to establish whether building work (including electrical installation work) complies with the requirements in Schedule 1 to the Regulations.

There have been reports that some local authorities are asking householders to have electrical installation work inspected, tested and certificated by someone other than the person carrying out the work. Section 33(2) of the Building Act 1984 (which would give power to local authorities to require persons carrying out building work to carry out such reasonable tests, at the person's expense, of or in connection with the work for the purpose of enabling local authorities to ascertain whether the work complies with the requirements of the Regulations) has not been commenced. This means in our opinion that local authorities do not have the power to require householders to retain an electrician to test and certificate the work in accordance with BS 7671. Local authorities which have adopted such a practice should discontinue it immediately

 
Hello Slips,

Thanks for that...As you can see the local authority talk in riddles!!! I spoke to the nice gentleman in charge and he told me "we are obliged to accept certificates as long as you can prove you are competant,17th edition, etc". I didn't argue that he had to accept my certs, I just accepted the fact he wasn't going to stand in my way. He did try to give the impression he was doing me a favour.

Oh to be in charge

 
Top