1976 v today

This really is a difficult topic from so many angles. A relatively short time ago we had an ice age, temperature records only go back around 150 years. I'm sure that global warming does exist and I think man has added to this but I don't think man is totally responsible for it. What we can do about it, I'm not sure, Ive done my bit with Solar, EV and heatpumps, my pollution has reduced significant as has my spend on fuel so that's a win win really. It was kind of satisfying the last couple of days running 4 x heatpumps from the solar PV keeping the house cool.
What we do have to do is make co-ordinated changes to our pollution worldwide not unilaterally. No good me giving up my 4.4 TDV8 diesel for an EV if across the pond in USA theyre all buying new 7 litre V8's.

johnb2713 said:

This really is a difficult topic from so many angles. A relatively short time ago we had an ice age, temperature records only go back around 150 years. I'm sure that global warming does exist and I think man has added to this but I don't think man is totally responsible for it. What we can do about it, I'm not sure, Ive done my bit with Solar, EV and heatpumps, my pollution has reduced significant as has my spend on fuel so that's a win win really. It was kind of satisfying the last couple of days running 4 x heatpumps from the solar PV keeping the house cool.
What we do have to do is make co-ordinated changes to our pollution worldwide not unilaterally. No good me giving up my 4.4 TDV8 diesel for an EV if across the pond in USA theyre all buying new 7 litre V8's.

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we had a mini ice age in the middle ages, hence all the frost fairs on the Thames. So whilst not as complete as modern data recording there is a lot of evidence for temperature changes over millenia from diaries and the writings of scholars over millenia. Ice cores give us the most evidence, along with lots of geological records. Eg you may find a particular plant pollen in soil samples, and if you know that plant only grows in deserts, then you can work out the temperature of that area at the time. The fact that this information is not as complete as we would like it, is one of the climate change sceptics favourite arguements for pouring doubt on the current situation.

https://www.bas.ac.uk/data/our-data/publication/ice-cores-and-climate-change/#:~:text=Ice cores are cylinders of,and 800,000 years in Antarctica.

However, that doesn't change the fact Exxon's own research back in 1968 concluded the following, see link below, and our ability to model climate change has improved vastly since then, hand in hand with computer technology. Exxon had decided to become an energy provider rather than just oil based as a business, they were making shed loads of money, and had decided to invest lots of money into technology research and pure research in many diverse fields, including nuclear. Their climate guys were well respected and invited by NASA to try an explain the climate of Venus - it's from that bit of research the the term 'Greenhouse Effect' came.

https://www.smokeandfumes.org/documents/16
Small personal changes are great, but, to affect change at the levels we need, we need governments to act.

binky said:

Small personal changes are great, but, to affect change at the levels we need, we need governments to act.

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Exactly, hence my last sentence we need a co-ordinated effort worldwide on all fronts.

johnb2713 said:

Exactly, hence my last sentence we need a co-ordinated effort worldwide on all fronts.

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My bad, skim reading whilst trying to build a wildlife pond.

Previously a major complaint is that fossil fuels are cheaper, but, the war in Ukraine has so changed that position I'm of the opinion the the UK could quite happily go it alone on energy and get ahead of the game, maybe even become world leaders in certain areas of green tech and earn valuable export dollars this country so badly needs. It's exactly the sort of thing some government funding would aid so much, if they had the foresight.

binky said:

My bad, skim reading whilst trying to build a wildlife pond.

Previously a major complaint is that fossil fuels are cheaper, but, the war in Ukraine has so changed that position I'm of the opinion the the UK could quite happily go it alone on energy and get ahead of the game, maybe even become world leaders in certain areas of green tech and earn valuable export dollars this country so badly needs. It's exactly the sort of thing some government funding would aid so much, if they had the foresight.

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Completely agree. One guaranteed energy source - wave power we are surrounded by, we really should be spending more money developing this for sure, the potential is huge with two tides per day.
I still don’t understand why in the Uk electricity price is linked to the global gas price. We have our own gas, we have have our own wind and solar energy, who is it that’s set the kWh selling price on our grid? The cost of electricity generation has not tripled over the last 12 months, no way.

johnb2713 said:

Completely agree. One guaranteed energy source - wave power we are surrounded by, we really should be spending more money developing this for sure, the potential is huge with two tides per day.
I still don’t understand why in the Uk electricity price is linked to the global gas price. We have our own gas, we have have our own wind and solar energy, who is it that’s set the kWh selling price on our grid? The cost of electricity generation has not tripled over the last 12 months, no way.

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there's been quite a lot of wave projects down my way, but they never seem to get anywhere, I think the mechanics get destroyed by sea water?

as for pricing, it's a free market enterprise, I don't really know how it works, but as we are linked to europe via various cables I'm guessing that it's based on European demands, and as Germany is gas dependent, I would guess demand from them is pushing prices up?

binky said:

there's been quite a lot of wave projects down my way, but they never seem to get anywhere, I think the mechanics get destroyed by sea water?

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We need to adopt Edisons mentality with this as per his diary entry :-
"Today I found the 176th way NOT to make a lightbulb"

as for pricing, it's a free market enterprise, I don't really know how it works, but as we are linked to europe via various cables I'm guessing that it's based on European demands, and as Germany is gas dependent, I would guess demand from them is pushing prices up?

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Free market doesnt seem to work though, lots of producers with windturbines and solar can generate electricity at a much lower cost than we the consumers are being charged. Surely in a truly free market they would be unrestricted at what they can sell their energy for?
Someone, somewhere is setting the current excessive prices. Only a very small percentage is imported so why we should be tied to EU prices I really dont understand. Right now we arent importing any electricity into the UK, 41% is being generated by gas, most of the gas comes from our own gas fields, imported gas comes from Norway, why on earth does Putin have any influence over our gas price?

I agree that we are missing our way with tidal power. The problem is that the effective way to harness it would be with barriers across estuaries. The environmentalists would obstruct this, and as we know vocal minority groups tend to prevail. Shame really as barriers would bring long term environmental advantages too.

One across the southern seas would bring economic advantages too…………

Geoff1946 said:

I agree that we are missing our way with tidal power. The problem is that the effective way to harness it would be with barriers across estuaries. The environmentalists would obstruct this, and as we know vocal minority groups tend to prevail. Shame really as barriers would bring long term environmental advantages too.

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that's always bothered me, one group lobbying for green energy, then another bunch lobbying it's bad for birds or something that will be badly affected by global warming. ... can't please everyone

binky said:

that's always bothered me, one group lobbying for green energy, then another bunch lobbying it's bad for birds or something that will be badly affected by global warming. ... can't please everyone

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sometimes the members of both groups are the same

Andy™ said:

sometimes the members of both groups are the same

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Yep.

We are all in huge trouble, to many people now on planet. I think it's to late to turn now as damage has been done. I also watch to many movies lol. The film for me which the writer did research on was the day after tomorrow. An old film now but bits do pop up like in that film.

Gian said:

We are all in huge trouble, to many people now on planet. I think it's to late to turn now as damage has been done. I also watch to many movies lol. The film for me which the writer did research on was the day after tomorrow. An old film now but bits do pop up like in that film.

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I agree. Humans have become a plague on the planet.
I'm not really religious or believe in any superior being, but I do believe that Nature has its ways of correcting problems.
It's worrying to consider too much what the solution may be.

Geoff1946 said:

I agree. Humans have become a plague on the planet.
I'm not really religious or believe in any superior being, but I do believe that Nature has its ways of correcting problems.
It's worrying to consider too much what the solution may be.

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there is no short term solution that doesn't involve mass murder

BBC2 tonight 21.00 hours, Big Oil v the World - it covers the Exxon scandal. If you like a conspiracy theory, should really be up your street, although this programme will not need tin foil hats or involve alien lizard people .

And on a lighter note.....................

SPECIAL LOCATION said:

And on a lighter note.....................

View attachment 13780

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so that's what they mean when they say whale populations are increasing

So displacement theory exists in reality!!

SPECIAL LOCATION said:

And on a lighter note.....................

View attachment 13780

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Brilliant lol