12v towel bars vs 240v (they are not 50% more efficient as claimed)

[ozz]

The marketing blurb claims the 12v towel bars are
"50% more efficient than traditional electric towel bars"
Having asked them to explain they have claimed
"because they use transformer that mean they can be 12v SELV (safety extra low voltage) this means they use less energy to heat up and the call for heat is less"

Now its been a while since I was in a classroom but even I know this is just not correct.
Was hoping someone much more educated and erudite could simply explain this please?

That a 12v towel bar is so low power it will not heat and dry your towel, but that they are not 50% more efficient, just they 'draw?' a load less power, don't heat properly and that is why they use less heat.

If memory serves doing this and putting it through a transformer would actually be less efficient than a 240v towel rail?
The guess is they are done at 12v to solve the very real issue of having 240v in a bathroom.
To do that properly needs the towel rail to be built to a very high standard and be absolutely safe.

Many thanks

 

[Geoff1946]

Welcome. You are dead right. It's a blatant lie!
1 Watt in gives 1 Watt out, and as you say a small amount will be lost by the transformer, so the actual towel rail will be less efficient, not more.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

There are no more issues or problems having a 240v towel radiator in a bathroom anymore than having a 240v electric shower over a bath or inside a shower enclosure.

Transformers do NOT save energy...
They just transform the voltage up or down (or just provide isolation at the same voltage such as shaver sockets).
The do consume a very small amount of power due the natural losses of the process..

But they do NOT increase or decrease any power..
and 12v is NOT a measure of power.. so you cannot say what the power unless you also know the current..
Power = volts x current.

e.g. If you have less voltage you will have higher current as the power has not changed.

 

[ozz]

There are no more issues or problems having a 240v towel radiator in a bathroom anymore than having a 240v electric shower over a bath or inside a shower enclosure.

Transformers do NOT save energy...
They just transform the voltage up or down (or just provide isolation at the same voltage such as shaver sockets).
The do consume a very small amount of power due the natural losses of the process..

But they do NOT increase or decrease any power..
and 12v is NOT a measure of power.. so you cannot say what the power unless you also know the current..
Power = volts x current.

e.g. If you have less voltage you will have higher current as the power has not changed.

Thanks, yes a 240v towel rail is the same as shower etc.
Obviously they need to be IP rated.
The 12v alternative is not IP rated.
Its believed its a sub-optimal way to 'use electric in a bathroom', ie cheap far easten product.

 

[binky]

nver seen a 12V towel rail. It would still need a reasonbale amount of IP rating to survive in a damp bathroom climate.

 

[ozz]

nver seen a 12V towel rail. It would still need a reasonbale amount of IP rating to survive in a damp bathroom climate.

https://www.thermosphere.com/products/bathroom/towel-bars
12v very low output
Do you think these could dry a towel?
They have confirmed no IP rating for these.
In the blurb they try and say designed and made in the UK. They are not really "they are imported as chassis and then constructed and coated in the UK"
I read that as a cheap far eastern product coated in the UK and put in a box.
Any thoughts criticisms welcome.

 

[Andy™]

They have confirmed no IP rating for these.

so not quite 'safe for anywhere in your bathroom' then.

wonder if 50% of the usual power means 50% more efficient? in which case you might as well hang your towel on the washing line in the rain

can't even get the description of SELV right either. but since its got 'safety' in it then it must be good

 

[binky]

https://www.thermosphere.com/products/bathroom/towel-bars
12v very low output
Do you think these could dry a towel?
They have confirmed no IP rating for these.
In the blurb they try and say designed and made in the UK. They are not really "they are imported as chassis and then constructed and coated in the UK"
I read that as a cheap far eastern product coated in the UK and put in a box.
Any thoughts criticisms welcome.

Interesting design, I suspect efficiency claim is simply down to it being a single bar rather than a complete towel rack, unless you install multiple bars. As a single bar it's not going to do too much for drying your towels as only a limited amount of the towel will be in contact with it. You also need to find somewhere for the transformer to go that's accessible.

 

[Andy™]

You also need to find somewhere for the transformer to go that's accessible.

according to th instructions, 'ceiling void'

 

[binky]

according to th instructions, 'ceiling void'

I did see that, fine if it's not on the ground floor

 

[Andy™]

but what if you live in a bungalow? do you need to add another floor to install them?

 

[Geoff1946]

Didn't seem to quote a wattage so it's hard to judge. Also different numbers of bars shown. Towels will dry without additional heat eventually, so lower wattage = slower drying. Regular powered rails are typically 100 - 150 watts.

 

[Andy™]

Didn't seem to quote a wattage so it's hard to judge. Also different numbers of bars shown. Towels will dry without additional heat eventually, so lower wattage = slower drying. Regular powered rails are typically 100 - 150 watts.

says 25w on the 'technical data' for a single mount, 25-37 for double

not getting much heat from that