Additional PV not on a FIT - how to deal with conflict

[webby252]

I have a customer with a 4KW installation that they get FIT for. It all goes thorugh a smart meter and they get paid on what they generate and export as you would expect.
I'm about to install 8KW more of solar which obviously has no FIT.
All this will now go through the smart meter. They will be signing up for a tariff that then enables them to export excess to the grid and get paid for it.
Does anyone have any experience with this? How can you have these 2 installations on 1 meter? Site is single phase.
I asked Octupus who will buy electric back but they said they've never come across a situation like this which is odd.
It doesn't seem too unusual that someone would install extra PV once the first lot (on a FIT) has been installed.
Any ideas?
Thanks

 

[binky]

The fit system should have it's own meter separate from the main household meter.

Have you applied to the DNO for any additional export? It's a legal requirement to do so if exceeding 16A of export prior to installation.

 

[Geoff1946]

Hypothetical, because I haven't done it, but my FIT contract is with a different supplier to my energy supplier and relies solely on my generation meter readings. (BG and TEF respectively)
They wouldn't know what changes I made to my energy supplier contract, unless of course I'm legally obliged to tell them(?). I don't have a smart meter.

 

[webby252]

The fit system should have it's own meter separate from the main household meter.

Have you applied to the DNO for any additional export? It's a legal requirement to do so if exceeding 16A of export prior to installation.

Thanks for the quick reply.
Yep, DNO in place.
The FIT does have its own meter but the're about to have a smart meter installed (prior to the additional PV). Will the FIT PV and the new PV not then go through the smart meter and then they'll get 'double paid' for the FIT element?
Or when they register with a company for export will they then fit their own smart meter meaning 3 meters
1. Main smart meter
2. FIT PV meter
3. New PV meter for new panels
Thanks

 

[ProDave]

Under the old FIT you got paid for "deemed export" which was assumed to be half what you generated unless you had an export meter.

How does that sit with having a smart meter AND being paid for export under what I think is called SEG? Is there not a confilct?

That is even before you install more PV where you will have so much it can ONLY be viable if you get paid for export?

 

[Oldman22]

You can under a FIT agreement get paid still for all generated on the FIT meter BUT elect with agreement from the company that usually pays your FIT to not get paid for your deemed export any more.
After that date any and all exported PV from either FIT or any other panels you have installed are paid to you via an export register on your new smart meter by the energy company you chose.

 

[binky]

1. Main smart meter
2. FIT PV meter

so you won't be feeding new array through the existing FiT meter

3. New PV meter for new panels
Thanks

Not needed, but no harm in fitting one.

basically there's absolutely no need to change FiT provider, it's perfectly acceptable to have your FiT with one company, and your leccy bill with another. It's exactly what I've got. So, if a.n.other company is happy to pay an export rate via the smart meter, that's all they need to know, and exactly how I would keep it.

 

[Leeds Solar]

They will need to end the deemed export element of the FIT contract, and switch that side of it across to SEG.

They'll probably be better off doing that anyway, as the FIT export rate is pretty low.

FIT payments won't be impacted.

 

[binky]

They will need to end the deemed export element of the FIT contract, and switch that side of it across to SEG.

They'll probably be better off doing that anyway, as the FIT export rate is pretty low.

FIT payments won't be impacted.

Used to be 4.5p.

 

[Oldman22]

5.99p in Dec 2022 before I opted out of that part of my FIT agreement.

I now buy at 5p/kWh via Tomato energy overnight and sell my surplus solar at 4.1p/kWh to Octopus on SEG. Thats a loss compared but with 20kWh of battery store I am trying hard not to have spare solar to give away.

 

[webby252]

Thanks for all your replies and sorry for the delay in getting back.
So to summarise.....
1. Contact the current energy company managing the FIT payments and opt out of the deemed export.
2. Set up a SEG for the whole lot (old FIT solar and new solar) that will run through the household smart meter.
Will the company managing the FIT not question why you want to opt out of the deemed export? Or will they assume you just got a better deal elsewhere?
Thanks

 

[Oldman22]

1. is correct.
2. I would look into companies like Octopus energy who have tariff's paying more than SEG and that may well put you said export tariff for all of your new + old pv without need for an all encompassing MCS certificate.
Lastly the old FIT management company don't care much why you are opting out of deemed export. They will just amend your contract.

 

[binky]

1. is correct.
2. I would look into companies like Octopus energy who have tariff's paying more than SEG and that may well put you said export tariff for all of your new + old pv without need for an all encompassing MCS certificate.
Lastly the old FIT management company don't care much why you are opting out of deemed export. They will just amend your contract.

is it 'illegal' to claim export twice? I ask because I've been out of solar for a few years now and lost touch.

 

[Oldman22]

Are you suggesting not telling the FIT agent you want to opt out?
If so you may just get away with it but you did sign a legal (FIT) document and by claiming elsewhere for the same exported PV you must surely risk having the contract cancelled if found out.
I was just squeaky clean in my dealings as I quite enjoy getting paid for my Solar generation.

From my contract which is eye wateringly long so just snippets here:

6. Exported Electricity- Opt Out 6.1 You may opt out of receiving FIT Payments for electricity that the System has exported to the local electricity network. Contact us by email or letter to confirm your request in writing. Your opt out will become effective at the start of the next FIT Payment period as long as the period between opting out and the next payment period is more than 28 days. You can opt in again, at the market based price, 12 months after You opted out.

Payment Criteria:
• You’re not receiving payment from any other energy supplier (or other third party) or from Us under a separate agreement for electricity generated by Your System.

Changes to Your System
11.1 You must let Us know in writing if You make any modifications or changes to Your System (including any extensions, installation
of any Storage Device, changes to meters, including if a smart meter has been installed and/or the installation of an Export Meter) as
this may affect its eligibility and capacity calculations which, in turn, may affect Your Tariff Code, Generation Tariff and Export Tariff.
Let us know immediately after any modifications or changes have been made.
11.2 If you don’t tell Us and we then discover or are made aware that modifications have been made then We’ll notify Ofgem who will
take appropriate action which may include changing Your Tariff Code, changing the amount of any FIT payments payable and/or
recovering from You any
amount of a FIT Payments that should not have been paid. As such We reserve the right to suspend, withhold or recoup any FIT
Payments in accordance with Ofgem’s instructions.
11.3 If the change to Your System impacts Your Tariff Code and/or Generation Tariff unit rate, Ofgem will notify Us of any change and
We will in turn update You of the change to be made and may send You a revised FIT Plan by email or post. Any such change will
take effect from the point at which the Central FIT Register is updated by Ofgem.

 

[binky]

Are you suggesting not telling the FIT agent you want to opt out?
If so you may just get away with it but you did sign a legal (FIT) document and by claiming elsewhere for the same exported PV you must surely risk having the contract cancelled if found out.
I was just squeaky clean in my dealings as I quite enjoy getting paid for my Solar generation.

I was squeaky clean, until the government decided to destroy the FiT and most of my buisness with it - gone a bit rogue since

I dropped solar about 6 years ago, so have seriously forgotten a lot of stuff like this. Didn't realise you could opt in and out of the Export payments.