Buy To Let Electrics

[OnOff]

Let me start by saying though I am NOT a scam member (yet). Anyway, in the process of buying a property as a buy to let. 2 up, 2 down. It is outwardly in VERY good order as in you wouldn't mind living there yourself. High standard of decor etc etc. Only had the one viewing myself and the CU was under the stair cupboard with all their gear they had put in there to tidy the place up for the viewing. By squeezing a folded pushchair out of the way I could just see it side on. Like an idiot the phone battery was dead so no photo. From a side on view it looks like a metal clad board with just a DP switch and a line of re-wireables - <6 in total. Again, didn't catch the make. So, no RCD, no MCBs etc so not a "modern" board. We've just had the search done and in it the tenants have stated that "No electrical works have been carried out since Jan 2005". Hmmmmmm! The owner's mother in law showed us round and waxed on about how her husband who's a kitchen fitter had done such a lovely job of the kitchen. TBH it does look the dog's danglies. Elsewhere in the search they have stated that there are "no certificates" for the electrical system. Why would there be? They've had no work done since 2005 have they!

So I'm thinking the obvious that the kitchen has been done recently and it's either all in blue & brown or he's a bit sharp and it's all in old stock black and red. Did I mention that the bathroom also looks rather recent?

Either way, as I'll be renting this out it will all need sorting properly. Makes a mockery of my wife's resistance to me joining a scheme (on cost grounds; "You'll never use it"). I keep debating scheme membership. This new one, another property I own/rent that will shortly need a 10 year EICR, my own place. FFS I probably spend

 

[shed69]

Part p, no part p, 2005, no 2005.... My point being that there should still be certs regardless of when it was done and that way you would then know when and who carried out the work.... I would be swayed towards an eicr or request that you go check the colour as you mention.... If they refuse you access as an electrician then maybe they know they've told a porky on the solicitors questions sheet...

 

[kerching]

Well if it is of any help we have just sold my mother in laws bungalow. Bought by someone as a Buy to Let. Nobody asked for any certs for anything. The electrics are dire, TNS no water/gas bond, 3036s [yes I know], boiler is a bit moody, conservatory roof leaks like a Government Secret etc etc etc............ :coat

 

[OnOff]

Part p, no part p, 2005, no 2005.... My point being that there should still be certs regardless of when it was done and that way you would then know when and who carried out the work.... I would be swayed towards an eicr or request that you go check the colour as you mention.... If they refuse you access as an electrician then maybe they know they've told a porky on the solicitors questions sheet...

Cheers for that. I was more intimating that I think they may have had work done that was notifiable - and haven't done so. Even if I go and take a couple of covers of I could find it's red and black - how to prove it.....trace the batch numbers on the "new" back boxes, forensic analysis on the new cpc sheathing? I wonder if there is any comeback AFTER the sale as in if after purchase I find they've told porkies etc. The survey hasn't been done yet so that might pick something up. Cheers.

 

[Manator]

I would have thought that any signature of this type would be fraudulent, so you would have rights even after the sale if things show differently.

 

[ProDave]

Yes is rather conveniently sounds like ALL the work he DIY'd was done before Part P came into force and he didn't do anything post Part P.

Should still have issued at least a MWC but then again a DIYer doesn't usually know that.

Regardless of what work has or hasn't been done, I would fit a new CU and in the process do a thorough test and inspection of the installation. That way you know nothing will come back and bite you when you get tenants in.

Re the brown/blue or red/black issue. That did not coincide with part P, it happened earlier, so it's quite possible to have pre Part P work in brown/blue. However it can be a nice little earner if you get some decent length offcuts or red/black to sell them on ebay for those who are convinced red/black = pre part P.

And don't expect the surveyor to tell you anything about the electrics, they know jack about wiring regs.

It looks to me like you are buying this with your eyes open. You KNOW it's an old CU. You KNOW it's had some DIY electrical work. you KNOW it will probably need some upgrading and alterations.

So factor in a CU change and a few wiring upgrades into your offer price.

Otherwise pay your own electrician to do a PIR and quote for the remedials and use that as a lever to negotiate the price down.

 

[OnOff]

Well if it is of any help we have just sold my mother in laws bungalow. Bought by someone as a Buy to Let. Nobody asked for any certs for anything. The electrics are dire, TNS no water/gas bond, 3036s [yes I know], boiler is a bit moody, conservatory roof leaks like a Government Secret etc etc etc............ :coat

I already own another buy to let (oddly enough in the same street as the new one). Had an EICR (PIR) done on that and have BG (3 Star I think it's called)in annually for the boiler etc. Safe tenants keep paying! I don't want to get tagged with the rogue landlord label! The new one will be no different.

 

[Andy™]

Re the brown/blue or red/black issue. That did not coincide with part P, it happened earlier, so it's quite possible to have pre Part P work in brown/blue. However it can be a nice little earner if you get some decent length offcuts or red/black to sell them on ebay for those who are convinced red/black = pre part P.

equally, you could still use red & black after part p for a while, so even red & black may have needed notified

 

[ProDave]

equally' date=' you could still use red & black after part p for a while, so even red & black may have needed notified[/quote']Quite right, the cable colour changeover spanned quite a long period when either could be used, and Part P happened somewhere in the middle of that time span.

 

[Doc Hudson]

Any reputable electrician would still have issued certificates for his/her work whenever it was done. Work done in 2005 would still have needed RCDs for sockets likely to supply portable equipment outdoors, (e.g. downstairs ring). and if there is no PIR issued since 2002 it is due for one now anyway notwithstanding the fact its a change of ownership. The simple solution would be to get a Periodic inspection done, while doing the inspection open up a sample of the kitchen and bathroom accessories.

Doc H.

 

[OnOff]

Cheers for all the comments. I was aware there was a hiatus period after part P came in for using the old colours etc. Didn't know blue/brown was available before though!

I'm sure this will go EICR + new CU. My options are I guess:

1) Get someone in to do an EICR and new CU

2) Do it myself as a competent, non-scheme member and pay the LABC

 

[steptoe]

I used some 16mm T&E in brown blue circa 2002 IIRC,

 

[Doc Hudson]

Cheers for all the comments. I was aware there was a hiatus period after part P came in for using the old colours etc. Didn't know blue/brown was available before though!I'm sure this will go EICR + new CU. My options are I guess:

1) Get someone in to do an EICR and new CU

2) Do it myself as a competent, non-scheme member and pay the LABC

 

[batty]

I was enrolled in November 2004 for the part p?

 

[Steve3948]

I was enrolled in November 2004 for the part p?

I'm that old I don't remember anything :coat :coat

 

[PC Electrics]

As an electrician, you could do an EICR yourself.

If you suspect that notifiable works have been carried out since 2005, then make an offer that is conditional upon the current owners taking out indemnity insurance against any remedial works being required or retrospective notification being required. Raise the issue with your solicitor and ask him to draft a letter with the correct terminology.

It is possible, though, that the new kitchen is exactly the same layout as the old and that no electrical works were carried out.

 

[steptoe]

Ive said it before, so why dont I say it again,

when you buy a house the only thing you are buying is 4 walls and a roof (unless its a windmill! ),

you should budget to have everything thing else done to your satisfaction.

 

[Doc Hudson]

I was enrolled in November 2004 for the part p?

Presumably in preparation for the enforcement date of Jan 2005?

Building Regulations - Part P FAQs - IET Electrical

Doc H.

 

[kerching]

I was enrolled in November 2004 for the part p?

Well it serves you right! Look where it's got you... :coat

 

[ProDave]

Ive said it before, so why dont I say it again,when you buy a house the only thing you are buying is 4 walls and a roof (unless its a windmill! ),

you should budget to have everything thing else done to your satisfaction.

Actually it's even more basic than that.

What you are actually buying is a piece of land. It may happen to have a building upon it, and the building may or may not be to your expectations, but in law, it's the land you are buying, not the building.