C&G2330..Am i quaified or not?

[zeff737]

Hi chaps, this one should be short and sweet...i hope.

I got my C&G2330 level 3 last year and have just changed my job where today it was nesessary for me to disconect a 3 phase motor........

The spark that contracts with us went nuts saying that i carnt do that, (he's a right dick!!) so i told him i was qualified and to...erm go away!

He said are you *$%^ and dont touch anything again......Who's right??

It would seam a bit daft to go through three years of eveng classes when at the end of it i still can not take off a motor!

Thanks.

 

[a1]

Other than the City & Guilds 2330 levels 2 & 3, what other quals do you have?

And more to the point - What quals has that spark got?

 

[Brian 157]

This depends on your definition of qualified. If you look at the JIB definitions (www.jib.org) you're not fully qualified without the NVQ (of which the AM2 can form a part).

The JIB would not issue you an ECS card as a sparks (you'd get "Senior Graded Electrical Trainee" the old "improver" grade) but you more than meet the BS7671:2008 definition of a "skilled person" & With a regs qualification & a testing qualification (2391/2392) most of the scam providers would accept you as a domestic installer.

 

[zeff737]

All i have is my C&G 2330 2 & 3, our tutor said to work in an industrial setting thats fine but the addition of the 17th and 2391 should be done next (however other tutors said that the level 3 2330 was as good as 2391?)

as for what he has i dont know but i,d be amazed if he has 17th. and the quality of his work is shocking, i see faults all over the site.

---------- AUTO MERGE Post added at 15:25 ---------- Previous post was at 15:23 ----------

Thanks Brain, im a mechanical maintenance engineer and did this electrical training off my own back (and out of my own pocket) as everyone wants "milti skilled" these days, i'll be sticking to the factory floor and it would just be little stuff i'd be doing.

---------- AUTO MERGE Post added at 15:28 ---------- Previous post was at 15:25 ----------

This depends on your definition of qualified. If you look at the JIB definitions (www.jib.org) you're not fully qualified without the NVQ (of which the AM2 can form a part).The JIB would not issue you an ECS card as a sparks (you'd get "Senior Graded Electrical Trainee" the old "improver" grade) but you more than meet the BS7671:2008 definition of a "skilled person" & With a regs qualification & a testing qualification (2391/2392) most of the scam providers would accept you as a domestic installer.

with ref to the NVQ, its been made clear to us that its all but imposible to get as i would have to be employed in domestic, industrial, comercial and even farm work for six month to meet the grade.......is that true??

 

[Zeespark]

You can do the NVQ 3 in 4-6 months depending on how badly you want it really.

AndyGuinness

 

[Megaohm7]

I'm in a similar position too. I have C&G 2330 lvl's 2,3 and C&G 2382. I started out as a factory maintenance trainee, so no formal qualifications apart from experience. I have paid for all my courses to get the qualifications I have so far. I feel competent to do testing safely as well as inspecting and I plan to join a scheme provider so I can sign off my own notifiable work. I have not ruled out completing NVQ 3 either.. Who knows I might get signed off as a Qualified electrician in the eyes of the JIB, just before I retire... ROTFWL .

 

[Brian 157]

All i have is my C&G 2330 2 & 3, our tutor said to work in an industrial setting thats fine but the addition of the 17th and 2391 should be done next (however other tutors said that the level 3 2330 was as good as 2391?)as for what he has i dont know but i,d be amazed if he has 17th. and the quality of his work is shocking, i see faults all over the site.

---------- AUTO MERGE Post added at 15:25 ---------- Previous post was at 15:23 ----------

Thanks Brain, im a mechanical maintenance engineer and did this electrical training off my own back (and out of my own pocket) as everyone wants "milti skilled" these days, i'll be sticking to the factory floor and it would just be little stuff i'd be doing.

---------- AUTO MERGE Post added at 15:28 ---------- Previous post was at 15:25 ----------

with ref to the NVQ, its been made clear to us that its all but imposible to get as i would have to be employed in domestic, industrial, comercial and even farm work for six month to meet the grade.......is that true??

The NVQ requires a range of work in different conditions, there are 65 performance objectives to be covered 3 times in different conditions with different wiring systems (34 can be covered once by the AM2 exam). Over the course of the NVQ work would be in domestic, industrial, commercial and possibly agricultural installations using T&E, SWA, trunking, conduit, singles etc.

I've had guys complete in under a year & guys not complete in four years - it depends on the work you do & how much you want the qualification.

Edit/Delete Message

 

[boogaloo]

Yes, just go ahead and do 3 phase stuff. What does that so called spark know. Work on it hot too, if there is no one else around to stop you.

 

[moose man]

I had the same think last year when i ask what he had done turned out i was more qualified then him

he shut up then and let me get on with my work

nvq possible i am in industrial and i have just completed mine on all items

competed in 4 months so it is possible

 

[Riggy]

My view, for what it's worth is that you asked the wrong question. The issue is not whether you are qualified, but whether you are competent. Your friendly spark, nor the members of this good forum are in a position to decide that, the person responsible for the installation is who you need to talk to.

Remember also that whilst the spark may not have handled it in the best way, maybe he was looking out for you?

 

[androiduk2002]

This is where we as students or newly qualified are told a varity of different thing and confuses the **** out of us.

One of my lecturers has told us that after completing part 2 we should get into residentual work, our other lecturer has told us to become fully qualified we need to do C&G 2330 part 2 , 3 and the NVQ and then we are competent qualified electricicans in the eyes of the law (this lecturer also works for Summit Skills who set the course contents for C&G to follow) , we have also been told that we DO NOT have to do the 17th edition course as we are learning 17th edition and that we do not have to do any inspection and test courses as this is covered by the level 3.

I am told that this is the reason behind the up and coming course change to 2357 as it combines all the requirements to become "a qualified electrician".

I have been told that on the NVQ course they do have facities to swap students between companys who specialise in one sector or another IE if your company only do residential they can arrange a job swap with a trainee whos company only specialise is comercial/industrial. I am told for up to 6 weeks but again as I am not ready for the NVQ I havent investigated it further.

GuinnessGuinness

 

[ADS]

This is where we as students or newly qualified are told a varity of different thing and confuses the **** out of us.One of my lecturers has told us that after completing part 2 we should get into residentual work, our other lecturer has told us to become fully qualified we need to do C&G 2330 part 2 , 3 and the NVQ and then we are competent qualified electricicans in the eyes of the law (this lecturer also works for Summit Skills who set the course contents for C&G to follow) , we have also been told that we DO NOT have to do the 17th edition course as we are learning 17th edition and that we do not have to do any inspection and test courses as this is covered by the level 3.

I am told that this is the reason behind the up and coming course change to 2357 as it combines all the requirements to become "a qualified electrician".

I have been told that on the NVQ course they do have facities to swap students between companys who specialise in one sector or another IE if your company only do residential they can arrange a job swap with a trainee whos company only specialise is comercial/industrial. I am told for up to 6 weeks but again as I am not ready for the NVQ I havent investigated it further.

GuinnessGuinness

I am fed up of hearing people say this - what a load of tripe!!

Yes, the 2330 'course content' is taught to the 17th Regs - they're hardly going to teach you to the 15th are they?

BUT, the 'course content' doesn't cover every aspect of the 'Regs', nor does it go into detail of what info is found where in the Regs.

This is what the '17th edition' course/exam is all about - and you do need to do it, regardless of doing the 2330 or not.

As for 'I&T' being covered in 2330 L3 - yes it is......but not to anywhere near the level of understanding that is required for the 2391 - so another load of tripe!!

If you don't believe me, the minute you finish your L3, get hold of a 2391 paper from last year and see if you can answer all the questions within the time specified....I don't think so.

This kind of talk only serves to belittle the qualifications that other sparks have worked hard to achieve - don't be looking for short cuts, get on with it and get the required qualifications.

Rant over.

 

[androiduk2002]

I am fed up of hearing people say this - what a load of tripe!!Yes, the 2330 'course content' is taught to the 17th Regs - they're hardly going to teach you to the 15th are they?

BUT, the 'course content' doesn't cover every aspect of the 'Regs', nor does it go into detail of what info is found where in the Regs.

This is what the '17th edition' course/exam is all about - and you do need to do it, regardless of doing the 2330 or not.

As for 'I&T' being covered in 2330 L3 - yes it is......but not to anywhere near the level of understanding that is required for the 2391 - so another load of tripe!!

If you don't believe me, the minute you finish your L3, get hold of a 2391 paper from last year and see if you can answer all the questions within the time specified....I don't think so.

This kind of talk only serves to belittle the qualifications that other sparks have worked hard to achieve - don't be looking for short cuts, get on with it and get the required qualifications.

Rant over.

My rant in reply is plain and simple go **** ******** , as I explained in previous this is what we was told by two of our tutors one who actually works for sumit skills.

I was not attempting to belittle anyones qualifications and I am not looking to fast track , why else would I of sat through 18 months so far of evening classes to hopefully at the end gain my 2330 part 2 with a further year to get my part 3 ! ! ! !, why do I sit at home practicing what I am learning using my time and my money, why have I down loaded everything we have covered so far and restudied it all as well as re written all the othermaterial from classes.

As for the 2391 I cannot comment as I still have my part 3 to do , but I know that the failure rate is over 50% maybe it is just to hard as 2391/2392 is being discontinued as of 1st April this year as it will be covered by the new 2357 QCF the chances are I will not be able to take it anyway neither would anyone new that was considering entering the trade.

This forum used to be a friendly place where people was polite and even kind to others alas it is going towards the dark side.

As to my own rudeness I excuse myself after just finishing a 10 hour shift working nights with my days spent looking after kids and doing chores whilst managing on bewteen 4/5 hours sleep per day , and still doing all my revision and studying JUST to become what has for me been a dream ! ! !.

 

[ADS]

I am fed up of hearing people say this - what a load of tripe!!...................................................................................................................................................................................................As for 'I&T' being covered in 2330 L3 - yes it is......but not to anywhere near the level of understanding that is required for the 2391 - so another load of tripe!!............................................................................................................................................................................................................This kind of talk only serves to belittle the qualifications that other sparks have worked hard to achieve...............................................................................................................

The above sections of my quote were referring to your tutor (or whoever else gave you this information), so wind your neck in - I know you weren't stating this as your opinion.

.

The following sections of my post are my opinion (others may disagree), and the 'highlighted 'You's refer to students/trainees in general, not you personally.

Yes, the 2330 'course content' is taught to the 17th Regs - they're hardly going to teach you to the 15th are they?

BUT, the 'course content' doesn't cover every aspect of the 'Regs', nor does it go into detail of what info is found where in the Regs.

This is what the '17th edition' course/exam is all about - and you do need to do it, regardless of doing the 2330 or not.

As for 'I&T' being covered in 2330 L3 - yes it is......but not to anywhere near the level of understanding that is required for the 2391.

If you don't believe me, the minute you finish your L3, get hold of a 2391 paper from last year and see if you can answer all the questions within the time specified....I don't think so.

....... don't be looking for short cuts, get on with it and get the required qualifications.

Sorry if I offended

 

[androiduk2002]

I dont think the 2391 is going anywhere just yet

http://www.cityandguilds.com/1107.html?search_term=

Lists last registration for 2391/2392 as 1st April 2011

This could of course be cause the new QCF starts then so it might be an all in one course that is only speculation as I do not know what exactly the new course covers. But it is a 3 year course so it might cover alot more. A full time student now only does 2.5 days a week so its possible if they extended that it would be possible to cover a much wider sprectrum.

Of course I might be wrong but I am basing my information on what I have found.

 

[soulman]

The 2391 is to be put on the new qcf framework as a stand alone qualification, but will not change in content, and will of course still exist, this is one of the most respected electrical qualifications. The new qcf 2357 replaces the 2330 & nvq 2356 which will be difficult for adults retraining, as you will have to be working in the trade.