consumer unit question

[jow]

is this wired correctly? if not any advise how to fix or to improve it? thanks

 

[Sharpend]

Why is the utility company meter positioned where it is?  
 

are you a spark? 

 

[ProDave]

What country are you in?  Strange (to us) colours.

 

[jow]

Why is the utility company meter positioned where it is?  
 

are you a spark? 

thanks for the reply. the company meter location is not important, it just represent the electricity  IN (live and neutral) into the panel

What country are you in?  Strange (to us) colours.

thx for the reply, colors are not important, red is live, blue is neutral

 

[jow]

is the component's order correct?  if not any advise how improve it? thanks

 

[Phoenix]

Please start at the beginning, what is it you are trying to achieve?

 

[jow]

Please start at the beginning, what is it you are trying to achieve?

thx for the reply.

basically im looking for something more than the typical home installation which normally consists of a "double pole mcb" followed by an "ELCB"

so im trying to incorporate "surge protection" and an "over/under voltage replay/protector"  but im not sure where to place them in the circuit. thx

 

[Doc Hudson]

Please do not start duplicate threads it just clutters the forum. I have merged your two questions.

Have you read the manufactures instructions for the devices you ask about? Do you have any qualifications, as your first thread was posted in the DIY section?

It would probably help if you answer the earlier questions about what country you are in as well? 

Doc H.

 

[jow]

Have you read the manufactures instructions for the devices you ask about? Do you have any qualifications, as your first thread was posted in the DIY section?

It would probably help if you answer the earlier questions about what country you are in as well? 

Doc H.

thanks for the reply. I'm located in Malta, but originally from the UK and wiring in here is similar to the UK. I'm a qualified electrician. I have  diagrams but the problem is not the devices themselves but how to wire them properly together.  I'm quiet surprised i couldn't find said info much readily available given that i would have assumed that adding a surge protector and an over/under voltage protector/relay to a consumer panel is something very common, or is it?

 

[Bruspark]

the typical home installation which normally consists of a "double pole mcb" followed by an "ELCB"

Back to the DIY section then . . . 

 

[jow]

Back to the DIY section then . . . 

Keep up the humor   Obviously I was referring to the part in the photo which is the subject of the question.  OBVIOUSLY there are other components in a consumer unit but when electricity come out of the utility meter, in MOST BASIC SETUPS it goes to a double pole MCB and then to an ELCB and that's the part which I need to incorporate the SPD and RELAY.  But apparently my question is not easy hence I have yet to receive a constructive reply. (If it was easy I would not have asked said question in the first place)

While in the diagram i made it should perform well and it was done using schematics from each component , I was looking for some feedback with regards to the location of said components in case of a surge. Such as for example, should the elcb be before the relay or afterwards and so on.

Just for reference, the above will be in its own enclosure next to the utility meter, and it will lead to the actual consumer unit located in the building with the full blown consumer unit with another double pole mcb, an elcb and followed by the individual mcb's for each relevant circuit. (you know, the usual)

thanks again for the humor!

 

[kerching]

It's rare to find double Pole MCBs in the UK domestic installs

even rarer to find double Pole RCBOs.....except in my house and a very very few others

 

[jow]

It's rare to find double Pole MCBs in the UK domestic installs

even rarer to find double Pole RCBOs.....except in my house and a very very few others

yes right, the double Pole MCB is actually just the main switch, in my country most people call it inaccurately double pole mcb due to its resemblance to the mcb's  and i refereed it wrongly too  - my bad!

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

yes right, the double Pole MCB is actually just the main switch, in my country most people call it inaccurately double pole mcb due to its resemblance to the mcb's  and i refereed it wrongly too  - my bad!

The "simple" difference you have to ask yourself is....

Can the "device" disconnect the supply automatically upon detection of either Overload or Leakage....?

OR...  can it only disconnect the power following manual operation of the switch??

IF it is manual only it CANNOT be an MCB / RCD / RCBO etc.. etc.. 

Not that complicated really????

:C

AND just to add....

If someone comes on here asking "basic" questions about devices wrongly described...

the general perception is that "A.N. Other" is working outside of their scope and ability...

So responses may be less than forthcoming as anyone working outside of their experience

could be a danger to themselves and others local to the  supply in question.,

Guinness

 

[jow]

The "simple" difference you have to ask yourself is....

Can the "device" disconnect the supply automatically upon detection of either Overload or Leakage....?

..........................

thanks for the reply. you look very experienced on the topic in question (otherwise probably you wouldn't have just replied for the fun of it), are you able to advise if the updated diagram below is correct?  (thanks a million )

 

[jow]

just a brief, my concern is the location of the components, for example:

- should the position of the rcd be swapped with the relay? yes/no? why?

 - is the spd location correct?

-  is such setup useful, overkill?

 - are any of the components useless given the current wiring  as per diagram?

I read the schematics of both the SPD and the relay and wired as per the diagram, but my concern is that I couldn't find any info regarding adding both components in the same panel. so they might conflict or not work at all, that's my concern...
 

thanks again

 

[revjames]

Not seen the term 'ELCB' for a long time.......

 

[brummydave]

Install does often come down to manufacturer instructions really but I share your frustration when wanting to plan an install before buying anything and not being able to get said instructions!

I've never seen or used an over/under voltage relay so can't comment on its best installation location or purpose.

Surge devices often need their own MCB but some don't if they have a built in fuse.

Surge protection in the UK should have as short a live supply and earth connection as possible. Next to main switch and main earth terminal are good. Surge devices have lots of general info on this.

Try giving them a call! 

Also, different terminology like 'elcb' or 'rccb', 'utility meter' or  'main supply' is only a distraction from what you're trying to achieve.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

While in the diagram i made it should perform well and it was done using schematics from each component , I was looking for some feedback with regards to the location of said components in case of a surge. Such as for example, should the elcb be before the relay or afterwards and so on.

Just for reference, the above will be in its own enclosure next to the utility meter, and it will lead to the actual consumer unit located in the building with the full blown consumer unit with another double pole mcb, an elcb and followed by the individual mcb's for each relevant circuit. (you know, the usual)

thanks again for the humor!

Do you understand the concept of how (RCD's/ELCB's) work?

And if you do, do you understand how they may typically operate if multiple RCD's are protecting the supply to the same bit of circuit?

If your proposed arrangement is supplying more than one final circuit I certainly wouldn't be having any single up-front RCD.

Just use RCBO's for each final circuit.

:coffee    

 

[jow]

thanks for the reply. you look very experienced on the topic in question (otherwise probably you wouldn't have just replied for the fun of it), are you able to advise if the updated diagram below is correct?  (thanks a million )

View attachment 10962

Do you understand the concept of how (RCD's/ELCB's) work?

And if you do, do you understand how they may typically operate if multiple RCD's are protecting the supply to the same bit of circuit?

If your proposed arrangement is supplying more than one final circuit I certainly wouldn't be having any single up-front RCD.

Just use RCBO's for each final circuit.

:coffee    

thanks for the reply. RCBO's are a little expensive, especially when considering that what im trying to do will be multiplied by 20 (for 20 apartments)

thanks for the insight, very appreciate that