Dangerous lifting equipment..

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Hi All,

What you all think of this...

I know a bloke aged about 75 years old. He is the meanest person you EVER met. He decided that he wanted a four poster ramp [Like a garage has] in his shed at home and found a second-hand one in a local firm that sells and installs new ones. They wanted £1000 for it but he talked them down to £600

Now, he decided that he would install it himself, but I persuaded him not to, as, in the event of the thing not working, they would say he had installed it wrongly.

I installed a proper electrical supply to power the thing BEFORE it was delivered, and that was the end of my involvement with it. [thank god!!!]

A few days later it was installed, but the mean owner decided that the ramps on the end were too steep for him to get his car on there, and has been waiting for the firm to come back and fit longer ramps. They said they would, but I cannot see it, as it was, in fairness, TO THAT EXTENT, "sold as seen" complete with short ramps.

Now, yesterday, I went to have a look, and, while there, I put my 4 x 4 on there to test it.

Turns out that while it works and lifts the car no problem, it has not been installed correctly and the safety "latching" mechanism that locks the ramp BEFORE you go under the car only works very intermittently.

The idea is, that you raise the car with the hydraulics, and then drop it down until the locks engage. To lower the car, you must raise it an inch or so, turn a knob to retract the locks, and then lower the car.

The reason for the locks not working, is that for some strange reason, the muppet that installed, it apparently sawed off the bottom brackets that hold the locking "racks" that the locking bolts are intended to lock into, thus they [the racks] move out of line and, therefore bolts cannot enter the holes.

If you were to continue to lower the car, or if you left it and the hydraulics crept down, the lift would collapse, as one of more of the four corners would lower, whilst the other corners would be still locked in the air, thus tipping the car off!!

Also, the lock nuts that are used to adjust the locking racks had not been tightened, and nor had the locking nuts that secure the lifting ropes..... Worse still, there are cracks in the structure of the thing, in the worst possible place too, at the end of one crossbeam near where the lifting rope attaches and indeed, the crossbeam can be seen to be bent at this point....





 





Now, ok, he bought it second hand, and inspected it first, but then he is not a lifting equipment inspector...





 





As it is lifting equipment, even if it was second-hand, I would have thought that it cannot be deemed to be "sold as seen", as, he bought it from a firm that specialise in these things, the firm themselves installed it for him, and, being lifting equipment, even though this old chap has it for his own use, and it is NOT in commercial premises, AND it was second-hand too, I would have thought that the thing would have had to be tested and a certificate issued after installation...





 





It is obvious that they took it out of a garage where it had been inspected and condemned and was basically scrap..





 





What you all think????





 





john..


 
I would have thought that as a commercial enterprise have sold it then it still has to be functioning and most importantly safe, so long as they didn't sell it as scrap

even if they did sell it as scrap, they installed it, so it has to be safe (surely)?

just as a second hand car has to be in a road worthy condition

 
I wired a DIY installed one once. I know the guy had a devil of a job assembling it. Basically he must have put it together in the wrong order and had to bodge it by forcing parts to open up to get it to fit together.  But it did seem to work okay in the end.  I did notice that there was a test label on it of some sort that gave the end of life of the lifting ropes as about 6 months ago.  But the guy carried on using it regardless of the ropes being out of date.

If it's for private use I guess he can get away with anythign as it's only himself that is in danger?

 
Based on what you say  I'd say the installers had a duty of care to install it correctly and NOT saw off safety devices etc.  Second hand / making a bit of cash on the quiet , or not . 

Even if only to protect their own rear ends .

Or has Mr Cheapskate been messing with it , who knows. 

 
That is my point, that is why i told him to get THEM to install it at an additional cost of £350, so that in the event of a problem he would be covered.

He had not even tried to use it himself until i was there yesterday, and I discovered the faults.

He did say something about the installer "cutting off cleats" but i did not know what he meant, until i got home and googled a set of installation instructions for a similar one.

Now i know what the freshly sawn off "stubs" in the bottom of all four legs were!!!!

john...

 
Hi Andy,

Yes, when he bought it it was already dismantled and at their works. They delivered it, and they installed it too. [It was certainly not sold to the old mean git as scrap!]

I had rigged a temporary power supply, so they only had to fit a 16A plug [that i had left for them] and then plug it in to a 16mm SWA with an adaptable box and a socket on the end of it [that i had provided for them in order that they could test it] and it was only when i went back to "hardwire it" if you like, that i discovered the problems....

They did all the installing themselves. The owner says they did have a bit of trouble with one corner and kept spraying it with WD40.

john....

 
I’ve had two wire ropes fail at work. One was due to incorrect slinging practice the other on a 40T crane. I was driving the crane when I noticed the rope “birdcaging”, the load was on the floor as fast as I could before the rope failed totally.

Any lifting equipment needs certifying as safe along with follow up maintenance/inspections even though it is supposedly for “private” use.

The HSE would have a field day with the skinflint.

 
The owner says they did have a bit of trouble with one corner and kept spraying it with WD40.
 


must have been using the industry standard engineering flowchart...

AAEAAQAAAAAAAAPzAAAAJGYwZWQ0NjI4LWJmYzUtNDcxMi04NTI4LTgyNDAyZmI0YjQxZQ.png.b5ae3b4edd07434d710fdc14b8c64ce6.png


 
Hi Tony,

I cannot see the skinflint has done anything wrong..

He went and looked at the thing at a suppliers of garage equipment, he bought it, the suppliers themselves delivered it, the suppliers themselves installed it, and, one would have hoped, would have tested it and certified it.

The skinflint made my life a misery moaning until i went and hardwired it yesterday [so that he could use it] as i told him not to keep moving the SWA as it is not intended as "flex".

It was then, with me, the first person to try it, since the installers installed and tried it about a week ago, that the problems were discovered, [by me!!]

Personally, i think the skinflint should involve the HSE himself...

john...

 
tell them to come take it back and give a full refund since its not as described. yes, it was sold as seen, but they then altered it, so its now not as seen

as for HSE, im not sure this is within their remit?

 
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Maybe not the HSE regarding private use of the lift, but “I can I use your car lift?” is bound to happen. If he’s such a skinflint money is bound to change hands.

 
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Finish your supply work then give him your concerns in writing and walk away. Don't get involved, the issue is between the customer and the supplier/installers.

 
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He is one of them that had the 60 metre submain to his garage wired up by a muppet in 2.5 twin and earth stuck in a pipe... I told him it would be no good, but his mate who "is an electrician" said i did not know what i was talking about.... fast forward a few years and now he has had to fork out for 60 metres of 16mm two core SWA and all the associated bits!!!! Oh how i laughed!!!!

Had big arguments to force him to buy CW glands and not BW ones, and he even came up here three times trying to persuade me to do things his way [old garden hose] when i told him he would have to buy a length of 25mm plastic conduit to act as a sleeve through a wall [for the 16mm twin and earth to pass through] into the tin box on the outside of the house. [to terminate the SWA into...]

"why cannot you just poke the cable through??" because the cable needs proper protection through the wall and across the cavity and into the tin box. Why?? because if the cable chafes through and contacts the earthed tin box it will liven up your entire house [it is all TT] [yes obviously there is a 30mA RCD in his CU] and a second one in series at the garage end too. [No, i could not give a lettuced about discrimination between the two, more interested in the power being shut off quickly [40ms] than any potential "nuisance"]

"Why cannot you use garden hose" Because garden hose is not conduit, and the cable will not fit.

"why cannot you just poke the wires through" Because the cable sleeving must enter the accessory

and so it went on....

john...

 
If you are convinced it is dangerous, I would suggest disconnect any power supplies to prevent it being energised. Then give him your concerns and reasoning in writing, with possibly some form of danger notice attached to the ramp and supply, stating the supply should not be reconnected until the faults have been rectified. Leave him to sort it out with his supplier unless he is paying you to pursue them on his behalf.

Doc H 

 
I miss read the OP as the skinflint assembled it himself. But if the supplier put it together then I agree they should not have bodged it and should now put it right so it's safe.

 
I would point him in the direction of the LOLER regulations, follow Doc Hudsons advice and walk away.

I've been responsible for safety and inspection of lifting equipment used for lighting  rigs in theatres and the huge line array speaker stacks you see at concerts. I've also seen first hand what happens to a lighting grid when a chain hoist fails but the operator raising the grid was too busy chatting to a young lady...........

 
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