Fire-rated or not?

[whazza2]

Are fire-rated downlights required in a kitchen of a two storey house with a bedroom above?

Obviously its better to have fire-rated ones but they have already been purchased.

Building regs seem to condradict all the electrical regs and advice :S

 

[Badger]

fire rated spot are required any where a floorind is laid above fittings, (ie any living accomodation, but i only install fire rated wether its a loft or a living accomodation above

 

[m4tty]

What ^^ he says.

I've just done an extension with loft above and didn't use fire rated as builder supplied fittings. But think you'll need fire rated for your situation as your breaking the fire barrier. But I'm sure I read on here recently someone said they are not required in domestic but can't remember who said it. Not much help really sorry

 

[Stevie h]

Not ..... Only required on a 3 story house... There has been a thread in the last 2 days about this..

Cheers

Ste

 

[tom1]

if its a diffrent compartmention then fire barrier needs to be maintaned.

ie between two houses like terrice or semi, betwen flats, between house and attached garage or one that forms poart of the building,

so unless you are putting downlights in garage, in celing with flat above, then i think there is no need for them to be fire rated.

the lights i fit are fire, acustic ect but thats because i think they are a decent fitting and not to pricey so i just fit them as standard

 

[Sidewinder]

One thing, if you have a communal attic space.

Not that I would have any experience of this...

You would surely then need to fit fire rated/maintain the fire barrier between living area & attic as the attic would be common with another house, thus another fire compartment.

Not sure on the regs, but some of the rest of you do so I'll go with the flow.

Would have thought it would be in the IET "Building Regs" book?

 

[tom1]

good point that mate, although prob should be separte when they built it,

shared loft and pink plaster board celling. damn spanners in the works

 

[Sidewinder]

Was in one just a few weeks ago.

As I found out eventually to my "cost"!



See the other thread!

 

[m4tty]

Not ..... Only required on a 3 story house... There has been a thread in the last 2 days about this..Cheers

Ste

Where are they required on a 3 storey house mate?

I thought if you break a fire barrier then it has to be maintained with fire rated downlighters. And if there was living space above then they are required.

Why are they only needed for a 3 storey house. Just want to uNderstand?

Cheers

 

[ElectekAir]

My take on this Plasterboard has 30min fire rating if you drill a hole in it you have tampered with the fire rating and need a fire hood/ rated down light.

Last assessment cost quite a lot to replace 45 down lights for this reason

 

[green-hornet]

I have been away, or not on the forum for a while and I have noticed there is some confusion about the use of fire rated downlights.

There are a number of regulations that all electricians will need to be aware of when fitting any recessed fitting. In a domestic situation we have a number of potential problems.

Firstly fire rated downlights are designed to go into a fire barrier to help maintain that fire barrier at the required time limit, this is our first problem is the plasterboard ceiling in the lounge a fire barrier? Generally it would not be thought as one, however supposing a fire did break out in the living room and the ceiling held the fire back for 30 minutes without any recessed fittings.

The occupants would have a reasonable time to evacuate and insurance will be almost always covered, this is because the plasterboard even though not in itself fire rated will prevent the spread of fire.

Now if we had fitted downlights in this ceiling and a fire did break out the fire barrier would be compromised spreading the fire quicker than before. The problem for us, is if the insurance company decide that the effective barrier, (plasterboard ceiling), has been compromised by the fitting of recessed lights. This would probably never be the case but is a thought for any one who fits downlights. Having said all that as a general rule a ceiling would not be considered a fire barrier unless it offered protection for at least 60 minutes.

Another regulation we have to take into account is part E acoustic, any fitting should comply with the building regulations to prevent the passage of sound between floors or walls etc.

If fitting downlights into a loft space we have another problem Part L if you have to remove loft insulation, and Part C , which requires a vapour seal between living space and loft.

 

[PC Electrics]

My take on this Plasterboard has 30min fire rating if you drill a hole in it you have tampered with the fire rating and need a fire hood/ rated down light.Last assessment cost quite a lot to replace 45 down lights for this reason

Are you telling us that the NIC made you change 45 downlights for fire rated to satisfy your assessment? Assuming your assessor knows his 'stuff', he must have realised they were all fitted in a fire compartment ceiling presumably? See the advice below.

Whaz:

No, you do not need to go fire rated in your situation.

See my download from IETs 'Wiring Matters' magazine here:

http://www.talk.electricianforum.co.uk/downloads.php?do=file&id=89

 

[ElectekAir]

Well yes and no was building controll refusing to sign off, NIC told me i had to comply with what BC wanted.

 

[PC Electrics]

From the article:

"In 1996, the DoE and TRADA commissioned TRADA

Technology Limited (TTL), a member of the TTL

Chiltern group of companies, to test the effect of

recessed downlighters (with no boxing in or fire

hoods) on the fire resistance of plasterboard ceilings

with conventional rectangular joists. TTL has been

involved in fire research and testing for many years

and is the UK

 

[Cirrus]

I won't personally fit anything else but fire rated. I pay about

 

[tom1]

I won't personally fit anything else but fire rated. I pay about