In loft contactor for shower

[GeoffRC]

I have a 10.8kw shower with a 50Amp ceiling switch which is bulky and unsightly is there any way i can fit a 50/60amp contactor in the loft enabling me to have a a smaller switch in the ceiling 

 

[binky]

recessing the switch so that is flush with the ceiling might resolve your issues?

 

[Lusk]

Is there an actual requirement to fit a ceiling (or similar) switch, bearing in mind that a 60898 MCB is a qualifying isolation device?

 

[GeoffRC]

Thought of that binky but there is a joist right above switch position 

And for you Lusk the answer is I don't know but don't want power onto the shower all the time

 

[Lusk]

I would fit one of these ...

https://www.yesss.co.uk/cable-switches-sockets-c2/sockets-switches-c150/switches-c499/hager-50a-double-pole-switch-1gang-with-led-indicator-wmdp50n-p4631

on the wall outside the shower room myself.

 

[binky]

Is there an actual requirement to fit a ceiling (or similar) switch, bearing in mind that a 60898 MCB is a qualifying isolation device?

yes - local point of isolation, same as we fit cooker switches and spurs for boilers

 

[kerching]

Doesnt isolation mean disconnection of ALL live conductors.......and now Neutral is classed as LIVE a single pole isolator would not be suitable?

i may well be wrong, and usually am, but my brain is not working today and I am having a mare

just saying

 

[Lusk]

Doesn't isolation mean disconnection of ALL live conductors

I always used to think that , but see 537.2.1.1
 

@binky have you got a reg number for local isolation?

 

[Doc Hudson]

Is there an actual requirement to fit a ceiling (or similar) switch, bearing in mind that a 60898 MCB is a qualifying isolation device?

This would be mostly down to the manufactures instructions, which for a long time have generally said a double pole isolating switch with contact gaps min 3.0mm separation, or similar wording, must be installed. a 60898 would not provide this. 

Doc H

 

[Doc Hudson]

Pick any make or model you like do a quick search for installation instructions see what they say. e.g. Mira Sport 9.0kw give us. http://www.mirashowers.co.uk/onlinecatalog/pdf/1175283_w2_d_mira_sport_iug.pdf  Note the wording of bullet point 6 under the section Electrical on page 2 which states local isolation must be provided. Whereas bullet point 7. says a 30ma RCD is only recommended.  The small drawing clearly shows a local isolation point separate from the CU.

Doc H.

 

[kerching]

I always used to think that , but see 537.2.1.1
 

@binky have you got a reg number for local isolation?

That makes two of us!

every day is a school day!

scoob given

 

[binky]

http://www.voltimum.co.uk/content/shower-isolation

if shower was in a room next to cupboard with CU in the you may be right Lurch. However I wouldn't be happy with Neutral still connected whilst I changed a shower, Neuatral being considered a 'live' conductor or Line as they like to call it these days, hence on the cert I am currently vey bored writing, we have a box for line/line insulation test result.

I also once condemmed a shower isolator for being half way down the stairs, reachable by ladder - about as much use as a chocolate teapot

 

[Essex1]

Safe isolation does not require all line conductors to be isolated. Only that no voltage is present across all line conductors and earth. 

 

[Andy™]

http://www.voltimum.co.uk/content/shower-isolation

 Neuatral being considered a 'live' conductor or Line as they like to call it these days, hence on the cert I am currently vey bored writing, we have a boc for line/line insulation test result.

neutral is a live conductor, but not a line. SOT is also live/live

 

[binky]

it shouldn't happen but neutral, in a special location, with copper pipes - possible belt? Assuming shower isn't on RCD.

 

[binky]

just double checked my cert software, it says Live/ Live - my bad.

 

[ProDave]

Perhaps we should be like the yanks and refer to "hot" conductors.

Now, would neutrral be considered "hot"?

So if we are all afraid of neutral, becaise it's a "live" conductor, do you all turn off the WHOLE house just to change a broken socket front, because isolating the live to the socket circuit is not good enough as the "live" neutral is still conencted.

 

[binky]

no, but frequently trip RCD anyway.

 

[Andy™]

neutral is a 'live' conductor because it carries power in normal use...

but the fact that shorting neutral to earth usually trips an RCD is a pretty good indicator that there is a voltage difference (very small) between it and earth, even when line is switched off...

personally, i generally isolate at the MCB & if its dead, carry on. if the neutral and earth touch and trip RCD, then leave it til im done. not that im paranoid, but after pulling the wires apart, i usually check again, more so on the neutral on lighting circuits...

 

[binky]

I f just changing a socket, I normally put the neutrals in first. Any way we digress from the post. Just trying to think if building regs require an isolator for the shower, but I haven't got my books with me.