Is this PAT test ticket legal??

[zeff737]

HI chaps, i need a quick answer to this as its a bother to me.....

the firm ive joined as a mechanical maintenance engineer use a contractor to do ther spark work.......im 39 and have been round the block but as far as electrical work goes im a baby....ive just past my C&G 2330 so i have a fair idea of whats right and whats wrong but my hands on is next to nothing.

Ive spoted DOZENS of crap elec work, from IP failures with big holes is junction boxes to flat twin and earth fitted with a plug and slung loose over beams as a perminent instalation to bare conductor ends being taped up with earth tape and left hanging for over a decade with no idea what it was or if its live!!

The main problem is PAT testing.........the "spark" has not tested some (most) items around the works for years!!!, the ones that carry the correct tags are out of date....but heres the twits,.... he has started putting on his own tags from a hand held printer with this on. "THIS EQUIPTMENT HAS BEEN TESTED FOR ELECTRICAL SAFETY ON 1.12.2010 NEXT TEST DUE 01.03 2011". Thats only 3 months!!!!

no official stuff or initials....nothing...........is this leagal?????

Thanks chaps.

 

[Sidewinder]

Zeff,

You will get more comments, but my first one is that there is NO LEGAL REQUIREMENT TO PAT.

End of story, sorry bud.

I will have a think a little more on your situation later.

 

[NozSpark]

Here's my bit...

also,

it's up to the tester to determine the periods between testing, taking into account various factors including environment, use and maintenance

 

[zeff737]

thanks fellas....so does that mean he could test every month and get paid for each test??? does he not have to put on a correct tag with his details of who tested it for ressons of tracability?? after all any one could stick a home made tag on and then claim it was nothing to do with them if the brown stuff hits the fan!

 

[Sidewinder]

Ahh,

Now there is a Code Of Practice issued by the IET & info issued by HSE which gives recommended intervals, however as Noz says it is up to the "spark", which many PAT operatives are not, to decide on the intervals & recommend using their engineering judgement.

Also, there are guidelines for the "Tag" in the IET CoP.

 

[NozSpark]

Well,,, yes...

I bet you he won't come back to test if he's not going to get paid!

It's up to the customer in the end, but I would find it unlikely that their Public liability or employers liability insurances would pay out if someone was injured by a piece of equipment that had an out of date PAT label on it.

They should also provide some test results sheets so the readings can be monitored over time!

 

[zeff737]

Ahh,Now there is a Code Of Practice issued by the IET & info issued by HSE which gives recommended intervals, however as Noz says it is up to the "spark", which many PAT operatives are not, to decide on the intervals & recommend using their engineering judgement.

Also, there are guidelines for the "Tag" in the IET CoP.

tell me more about the tag guide lines mate,......hes a real knob and is giving me a really hard time as no one has ever questioned his crap workmanship before!!!!!....just remembered....HE doesnot sign for the REAL tags....his opo that is not a REAL spark but just a labourer does the PAT tests as he must have done the course in the past,...i wonder if his ticket has run out and there trying to cover their backs as they now know im on to them!??

 

[Sidewinder]

Ticket don't "run out"

PAT CoP is in van, very cold very late, have work 2 finish 4 2moro, will look up ASAP, keep reminding me, not trying to be ignorant, just busy!!!

 

[NozSpark]

TBH you don't have to have passed any exam or attended any course to PAT, you just have to be competent.

Labels are easily available from any wholesaler, they are available online!

The Label People ... see they're not even expensive!

 

[zeff737]

Ticket don't "run out"PAT CoP is in van, very cold very late, have work 2 finish 4 2moro, will look up ASAP, keep reminding me, not trying to be ignorant, just busy!!!

no problem mate, thanks alot, take care.

---------- AUTO MERGE Post added at 23:49 ---------- Previous post was at 23:46 ----------

TBH you don't have to have passed any exam or attended any course to PAT, you just have to be competent.Labels are easily available from any wholesaler, they are available online!

The Label People ... see they're not even expensive!

wow, thats news...so i could start to PAT test right away without having done any official testing course as long as i know how to work the tester correctly????

 

[Sidewinder]

Zeff,

NO you have to be competent in the testing and evaluation of the results.

BTW do you have a written report of the findings?

Paul

 

[NozSpark]

wow, thats news...so i could start to PAT test right away without having done any official testing course as long as i know how to work the tester correctly????

I did say you had to be competent!

TBH though for

 

[zeff737]

paul, we have sod all, he makes it up as he goes!

 

[Sidewinder]

OK,

Give me a day or 2 to quote you the CoP & post the HSE links, you can search HSE.gov.uk for electrical / electrical appliance testing for more info almost all of their guidance is now free to d/l. Don't forget the construction section too.

 

[zeff737]

I did say you had to be competent!TBH though for

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

First of all...

As BS7671 wiring regulation is NON-STATUTORY.. there is no legal requirements to test the main building wiring...

AND as there is NO legal requirement to test the building electrics there most certainly is NO legal requirement to test the portable equipment. appliances etc..

BUT..

if the place has people employed to undertake some work activity..

there IS A LEGAL REQUIREMENT to ensure the workplace is electrically safe..

This bit comes under the STATUTORY acts such as Health & Safety at work..

electricity at work etc..

So to comply with the health & safety aspect it is good practice to follow the guidance of BS7671 for the fixed installation, and follow the industry recognised Portable Appliance Testing guidance...

such as found in:-

http://astore.amazon.co.uk/talkelectrici-21/detail/0863418333

For a cheap overview of the basic requirements for PAT, this book is a good guide for less than a tenner!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/PAT-Appliance--Service-Inspection-Electrical/dp/0750687363/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1291247014&sr=8-1

There is nothing stopping someone specifying their own testing procedures & timescales to show a reasonable duty of care has been applied to ensure compliance with H&S law.

IMHO it would be hard to prove reasonable testing and accountability has been carried out without having any formal traceable record of appliances, test equipment used, and the name of the person doing the tests and date of the last test done.

:coffee

 

[zeff737]

so for the job to be done right there needs to be a paper trail to check against?

 

[Sidewinder]

yes

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

so for the job to be done right there needs to be a paper trail to check against?

Without some form of formal traceable documentation any testing is quite bluntly as much use as a fart in a colander!

If I remember correctly that little

 

[Apache]

You are supposed to do a portable appliance test of fixed items?

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