oven connection

[tom1]

got a 2.3 kw oven to install,

there is 1 socket on on this side of the kitchen there is also a fridge frezzer near the oven, they are tight on the money, so much so that they did not have a 20 amp double oven as they would definatly had to have a new feed to it.

the socket looks to be a spur off the ring.

2.3 kw and separate ring for kitchen so i dont have a problem with putting it on the ring but instructions say connect to dp control unit 3mm clearances on all poles, would a dp socket satisfy this so both oven and fridge can be plugged in to the one socket.

or swap the socket for a dule pattress with a fcu and single socket but would this be a spur off spur, cant see difference between 2 singles or 1 double except all are rated at 13 amps?

thanks

 

[a1spark]

I always prefer to fit single built in ovens on to a SFCU simply cos a 13Amp plug can run pretty hot when loaded up for long lenghts of time, on the other han many manufacturers produce them with moulded on 13A plugs....so i would say your plan of action could also be acceptable. I would definately confirm, however, that the socket was not a spur off a spur.

 

[tom1]

I always prefer to fit single built in ovens on to a SFCU simply cos a 13Amp plug can run pretty hot when loaded up for long lenghts of time, on the other han many manufacturers produce them with moulded on 13A plugs....so i would say your plan of action could also be acceptable. I would definately confirm, however, that the socket was not a spur off a spur.

that i will be checking,

could do single socket and fcu, put it down as a deviation

 

[a1spark]

Yep, or if you wished you could install one non switched Fused connection unit prior to the SFCU & Socket combo and you would be spot on with the regs

 

[tom1]

Yep, or if you wished you could install one non switched Fused connection unit prior to the SFCU & Socket combo and you would be spot on with the regs

10 amps for the oven not sure what the fridge freezer pulls

do you think 13 amp fuse will be ok.

they currently have a 13 amp sfcu feeding a 2g socket for washer and dryer

 

[a1spark]

13a FSCU will be no problem for oven & F/F....however.....

Would deffo never install a washing machine & dryer into the same socket outlet...overheating is a strong possibilty, remember that the 13A fuse in the FSCU will allow these two appliances to run simultaneously well above its rated capacity..it will only be providing short circuit protection with inadequate overload protection for the socket outlet.

 

[tom1]

13a FSCU will be no problem for oven & F/F....however.....Would deffo never install a washing machine & dryer into the same socket outlet...overheating is a strong possibilty, remember that the 13A fuse in the FSCU will allow these two appliances to run simultaneously well above its rated capacity..it will only be providing short circuit protection with inadequate overload protection for the socket outlet.

i have thought about this and would advise to extend the ring but if they dont go for it whats to stop them or any one plugging 2 high load appliances into a double socket

 

[a1spark]

The answer to your question Tom ,is Nothing !

Usually intermittant-Short duration overloading of a 13A socket isnt a problem on above worktop outlets,but extended overloads as in your example could cause problems.......I guess it comes down to design of circuits and I suppose its a good reason for inclusion of Kitchen wiring within the building regs.....Part P and all that !

 

[tom1]

The answer to your question Tom ,is Nothing !Usually intermittant-Short duration overloading of a 13A socket isnt a problem on above worktop outlets,but extended overloads as in your example could cause problems.......I guess it comes down to design of circuits and I suppose its a good reason for inclusion of Kitchen wiring within the building regs.....Part P and all that !

yer it is a good reason to include it,

current set up is fcu on the ring which feeds a 2 gang socket that both appliances are pluged into. would be easy enough to swap the 2gang for 2 single

 

[a1spark]

where will they then plug the second appliance into Tom ?

 

[tom1]

put in to single sockets fed from the sfcu, same as suggested for the oven and fridge

 

[a1spark]

Oh. I get you now.

I suppose if you were to apply diversity to the connected load at the FSCU then this could be a solution .it certainly removes the potential overheating of the twin socket...not sure about the terminals of the SFCU though.....what do you think ?

 

[tom1]

Oh. I get you now.I suppose if you were to apply diversity to the connected load at the FSCU then this could be a solution .it certainly removes the potential overheating of the twin socket...not sure about the terminals of the SFCU though.....what do you think ?

i was just thinking that, the brb does say unlimited sockets from a fcu.

 

[a1spark]

Tom you can find some useful info on this subject in Appendix 15 at the back of the Regs...it also gives guidance on spreading loads evenly around a Ring Final Circuit [ 20A max load in any one leg of a ring if using 2.5 t&E ...30/32A P.D.]

 

[tom1]

Tom you can find some useful info on this subject in Appendix 15 at the back of the Regs...it also gives guidance on spreading loads evenly around a Ring Final Circuit [ 20A max load in any one leg of a ring if using 2.5 t&E ...30/32A P.D.]

fair point.

 

[a1spark]

Didnt mean to start spouting Regs at you there Tom .just debating the issues with you.

We all know these issues arise ,especially in Kitchens, at the end of the day its your call as you sign the EIC as the designer as well as Installer /Tester

...Good Luck with it any way and let us know how you progress.

 

[tom1]

Didnt mean to start spouting Regs at you there Tom .just debating the issues with you.We all know these issues arise ,especially in Kitchens, at the end of the day its your call as you sign the EIC as the designer as well as Installer /Tester

...Good Luck with it any way and let us know how you progress.

it all good your right loads should be spead, it is a pain in kitchens, and utilitys, free standings appliances can be moved around and people always want there appliances near each other.

thanks for the advise

 

[a1spark]

Who Would want to be a Spark Hey Tom ! :good night:

 

[Couleddie]

Kitchens really are a pain!! How far do you go?? I don't like putting ovens on the ring especially if there's a washer and dryer too but at the end of the day you may have to compromise and if someone switches everything on at once and the MCB trips then the overload protection has worked and no harm has been done. Not ideal at all but that's what overload protection is for. Just had to put an oven on the ring this week. Not happy about it but I left the job in the knowledge that it was a lot safer than when I found it.

Sometimes we can't be perfect but we do our best.

 

[a1spark]

Kitchens really are a pain!! How far do you go?? I don't like putting ovens on the ring especially if there's a washer and dryer too but at the end of the day you may have to compromise and if someone switches everything on at once and the MCB trips then the overload protection has worked and no harm has been done. Not ideal at all but that's what overload protection is for. Just had to put an oven on the ring this week. Not happy about it but I left the job in the knowledge that it was a lot safer than when I found it.Sometimes we can't be perfect but we do our best.

Hi Couleddie , yes agree with you Kitchens can throw up problems....Care has to be taken that No section of the ring carries in exess of 20A. for any appreciable time ,otherwise harm can be done to the wiring and / or accessories.....overload protection in itself will not provide this function. Only carefull balancing of connected loads around the route of the ring will provide this protection.