PIR problem

[Traineesparks]

Good Afternoon,

Finger crossed someone can shed a little light on my problem as i am completely miffed and out of ideas

Basically i have a single 1 way light fitting in my bathroom operated with a simple pull cord, i have replaced the pull cord with a Occupancy Sensor 360 degree PIR Light Switch, nothing complicated single line in single switch line out (neutral) and single earth at the switch.

However......with a standard 60w ES lamp (bulb) in place nothing happens, i can hear the PIR switching as i am present but the lamp (bulb) doesn't illuminate when i replace the standard 60w ES lamp (bulb) with an Energy saving lamp (bulb) it continuously flickers !!

I have tried different lamps (bulbs) and they work in different outlets so i know they are fine, i have also tried the PIR on my lounge circuit which is identical, single line in single switch line out and single earth at the switch using again the same bulbs and the identical same thing happens.

Please don't let this beat me, any help with be appreciated.

thanks in advance.

 

[ProDave]

I suspect you don't have a neutral.

Often a light switch just has live in, switched live out and earth.

You need Live in, switched live out, NEUTRAL and earth. A total of FOUR connections (though it might not need an earth connection if it's class 2)

So some rewiring is needed.

If you can trace the 2 core & earth light switch wire back to a junction box or a light fitting, then replace it with a 3 core & earth so you can connect a neutral for your sensor.

you keep putting (neutral) in brackets after every mention of switched live. That leads me to think you don't understand what you are doing and think they are the same thing. They most certainly are NOT.

 

[Traineesparks]

Thanks for the quick reply, so what your saying is PIR's require a NEUTRAL unlike most 1 Way/Gang switches ?

 

[ProDave]

Thanks for the quick reply, so what your saying is PIR's require a NEUTRAL unlike most 1 Way/Gang switches ?

Yes. Otherwise there's nothing to power the sensor.

It's only going to take a tiny amount of power, but it is required.

 

[Doc Hudson]

Thanks for the quick reply, so what your saying is PIR's require a NEUTRAL unlike most 1 Way/Gang switches ?

Have you looked at the manufactures wiring instructions? as ProDave says, the electronics of the sensor cannot work without a supply, live and neutral. Every PIR sensor requires these in addition to the outgoing live to the lamp. A normal switch requires no neutral to operate it because it is mechanically activated.

Doc H.

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

There are a few movement detectors designed to replace light switches & need no neutral. They pick up a 'return' path through the lamp & have a capacitor or small rechargeable battery in them, so you can not use energy saving light bulbs such as cfl's in them. I have tried a couple of different makes & found this type not to be reliable.

 

[batty]

I find reading instructions always helps.

 

[Evans Electric]

Trainee, I think you may be confusing the switch wire , which may be black or blue , as a neutral .

Your pull switch probably had a two core cable , Brown/Blue or Red / Black .......... the red or brown was almost certainly the feed and the black/blue the switchwire.

So you need a Neutral from the light fitting to make the sensor work.

As the others have said .

Probably.

Almost certainly.

 

[Traineesparks]

Good afternoon,

Sorry to drag this up again, however i have this afternoon got around to getting some 3 core & Earth and rewired my light fitting and PIR, still i seem to have a problem, the light is permantly on as this is my first ever PIR i am unsure whether now i have a faulty PIR or i have done something wrong.

I will try and explain what i have done......

From Supply to Light fitting - Supply Line to Loop, Supply Neutral to Neutral block and Supply Earth to Earth block

From Light fitting to PIR - Loop to Live in (PIR), Switch Line from lamp to Live out (PIR), Neutral block to Neutral (PIR)

Additional connections - Lamp to Neutral block

I believe my connections to be sound because when i disconnect the PIR and connected a single switch it works fine however obviously i do not use the neutral wire with the single switch making me believe my problem with the PIR is possibly to do with the Neutral maybe, any help on this will be appreciated and please if its obvious be gentle lol

 

[Andy™]

some PIRs switch on for a few minutes when power is applied. how long did you wait?

 

[ProDave]

Do you have any test equipment to make any measurement? i.e an ac volt meter.

 

[Traineesparks]

Thanks for the quick replies, i waited around 10 minutes, i do have a multi meter.

 

[ProDave]

I would unplug the light bulb, and measure the voltage at your PIR sensor to confirm you really do have 230V between Live in and neutral. That will confirm if you have your connections correct.

Is there a sensitivity adjustment or time delay adjustment? I've never fitted an indoor one, but the outdoor ones I've fitted usually have those. Set sensitivity to minimum and time delay to minimum while you are testing it.

 

[Traineesparks]

Thanks as i was typing my last message it turned off lol 40 ish minutes it took :/ adjusted the sensitivity and all is good thanks again

 

[pickleye]

Power up on - oh what fun...

Had a situation last year after rewiring one section of a school.

Power cut in the area one night...

when power came back on, an auto door cycled (we believe) activating the intruder alarm.

Police attended and saw lights on. Three police vans and dog patrol called.

No damage found, nothing missing, no one apprehended.

OOPS