Question For Steptoe

[Evans Electric]

Just listening to R5  , stink blowing up about soldiers doing  the   Red Hand of Ulster Salute  and some carp about Glasgow Celtic   Or Rangers  . :C

Is it some religious nonsense ?

 

[pewter]

my misses is Scotch, one of the things that always surprises me about it up there is how into the football they are and they involve religion with it. Most of them have a Celtic or Rangers chip on there shoulder. I think because its such a cold damp dark s**t hole, they have to get drunk and argue about 11 blokes in shorts running around on a bit of grass.

When it is sunny some of them march around the town playing flutes and drums getting drunk and arguing with people, dressed likes kings day in Netherlands.

I dont think any of them actually go to church and believe in baby Jesus, they just like the argument.

 

[OnOff]

My mates a an old Jock from Glasgow, nearly 70. Catholic btw. Football mad and still trains with and subs for a local team. Reckons in the "old" days back home there was in incident where a lost footy fan asked a copper for directions. Just so happened the copper was of the opposing religious / football side. Urban myth maybe but it was said the copper deliberately sent the supporter down the wrong street into "enemy territory" where he ended up getting stabbed to death. I never realised the strength of the divide up there.

My cousins ex up there is a copper too. Proper Fulton Mackay clone, short back and sides and tache! Their idea of "fun" when an English team were playing up there was to force as many English fans as possible into the train station waiting rooms. When the crush was at it's peak they would launch a couple of exceptionally peed off police dogs into the fray. Frank thought it was hillarious. TBH I thought it was pretty funny too!

My late aunt was a serious drinker and quite happy to drink and drive. Weaving through Glasgow one day she sees her son in law and gives him the two fingered salute. Trouble was it wasn't Frank just another copper / Fulton clone. Frank was told when he got back to the station his mother in law was in the cells!

 

[steptoe]

Just listening to R5  , stink blowing up about soldiers doing  the   Red Hand of Ulster Salute  and some carp about Glasgow Celtic   Or Rangers  . :C

Is it some religious nonsense ?

jaysus Deke, thats a very heavy question,

the red hand salute goes back centuries, to when the warring clans in Ireland were fighting for territory,

there are basically 4 ancient provinces in Ireland,

Ulster

Munster

Leinster

Connaught

when the clans of Ulster defeated an enemy they dipped their hand in the blood and printed it on a tree [or some such like] to mark the territory as being theirs, or so the legend goes,

as for soldiers doing the red hand salute, I dunno, havent heard anything about it,  :C

the modern flag of norn iron is based on the ancient flag of Ulster, the main differences being,

the ancient flag had a yellow background, and no crown, the crown on the modern flag symbolises the allegience to the British crown.

but, I have no idea if that answers your question,  :|

 

[steptoe]

EDIT

ive just read an article about this

total and utter tosh that its a nazi salute,

go to norn iron during the marching season and have a look at the amount of Israeli flags flying beside the loyalist ones,

its done as a sign of union against terror, its a proven fact the republican terrorists and PLO were trading arms and knowledge with each other,

for any IDIOT to suggest its a nazi salute in front of an Ulster flag is showing a complete lack of intelligence and or knowledge of the facts and situation,

:shakehead

 

[Evans Electric]

Thanks for the excellent answer Stepps , most informative.

I don't begin to understand the ancient allegencies and hatreds if fact I have no time for them .

Growing up next to Villa Park does tend to develop an allegence and an interest in soccer but the partisan hatred didn't exist back then .

Grown ups would watch Villa play at home one Saturday then go to the Blues the next week to watch them at home , only 6 miles away or even watch West Brom  , about the same distance. 

The hatred began in the late 60s , not religious just moronic , and is worse between Albion and Wolves.   There is no histrory behind it , just emulating moronic behaviour seen on TV .  

They are so moronic that if the best player in the whole galaxy transfered from one of these four clubs to another ,  and scored 10 goals in every match he played for them ....the crowd would boo him off the park.  

The Scots seem to hate everybody especially the English but floated the idea of Celtic or Rangers playing in the English league a few times , obviously money was the driving force behind that one .

 

[Sharpend]

I thought it was becoming a conversation about sport, I admit to being thrown by steps when he mentioned Connaught, but then I realised that was the red herring cos they'd gone bust the others are rugby teams aren't they?

 

[ProDave]

I dunno about all this stuff.

All I know is people often ask me "who do you support, Rangers or Celtic"

You should see the bumbfound looks I get when when I say I'm not the least bit interested in football and I don't support either.  you would think I had insulted the Pope the way some of them look at you.

I won't even begin to pretend I know the first thing about what goes on in Norn Iron.  All I know is what you see on the news which seems to tell you this religious group hates that religious group and they want to blow each other up. Which is kind of strange as all religions teach "love thy neighbour" so it doesn't seem to follow their teaching.  And besides it appears to me to be nothing about religion, but whether NI is governed by the UK, or the republic, and that surely is a political issue not a religious one. So like I say , none of it makes sense.

 

[steptoe]

I thought it was becoming a conversation about sport, I admit to being thrown by steps when he mentioned Connaught, but then I realised that was the red herring cos they'd gone bust the others are rugby teams aren't they?

yes, each of the 4 ancient provinces of Ireland have [but you say Connaught doesnt?! ] their own rugby team.

I dunno about all this stuff.

All I know is people often ask me "who do you support, Rangers or Celtic"

You should see the bumbfound looks I get when when I say I'm not the least bit interested in football and I don't support either.  you would think I had insulted the Pope the way some of them look at you.

I won't even begin to pretend I know the first thing about what goes on in Norn Iron.  All I know is what you see on the news which seems to tell you this religious group hates that religious group and they want to blow each other up. Which is kind of strange as all religions teach "love thy neighbour" so it doesn't seem to follow their teaching.  And besides it appears to me to be nothing about religion, but whether NI is governed by the UK, or the republic, and that surely is a political issue not a religious one. So like I say , none of it makes sense.

Dave, unfortunately, from my perspective, its about neither,

perhaps in times past it was one or the other,

nowadays I would say its about gangsters, and who controls what,

be it drugs, prostitution, protection money, or whatever,

back in the day when I was working there everyone paid protection money, this side of the street was that lot you paid, the other side of the street was the other lot you paid,

its a very very sad state of affairs for a very beautiful country,

:shakehead

 

[steptoe]

as an addendum to this,

there is somewhat of an arguement as to what hand should be raised when approaching another clan,

my take on it is this,

as most people are right handed, the sword would have been in the right hand, therefore it would be the left hand that was bloodstained,

so it should be the left hand that is raised to show the 'red hand' ,

as it is imprinted on various objects to show territory, it appears as a mirror image, thereby being the right hand,

but, in ancient times to show your allegience it would have been the bloodstained hand that was raised in salute,

so all the idiots raising their right hand have got it wrong,

thats only IMHO though,

but, just goes to show the knuckle draggers up, doesnt it?........