R1+R2

[butler26]

hi guys going to do some testing on the circuits in my house next week , so i isolated the supply and removed the cover from my CU any way i have one of those fancy showers with the built in steamer , radio ect ,well this circuit seems to be on a ring with only the shower connected to it ,the problem i have is that when i pulled the shower out to see how its been connected it looks like who ever wired this has used a ring final then spured of this from a junction box using three core flex ,the wife says i cant lift up the carpet to confirm this because she says ill make to much mess anyway can i calculate r1+r2 from the open loops or shall i measure the r1+r2 from the panel that the flex is connected to

thanks

 

[paul b b]

A shower fed from a ring? Must be a smallshower kw?. What size cable do you have?

Also, if you are doing this for an assesment i would look at putting the appropate cable in for the shower.

Back to the question.......

How do you calculate r1+r2? Or do you mean ZS?

You can calculate zs by r1+r2 + ze , most times people measure

 

[pickleye]

Just a question, but, is the shower itself an electric one?

Brother in law has one of those fancy jobs too. The shower is off the gas water heating system. The radio, lights and fancy bits just spured off the ring, so, a flex is ample.

I didn't put it in so thats the limit of my knowledge, sorry.

 

[matt.leung]

it could just be a pump shower, which would require a flex source of power... rather than a fully electric shower..

 

[m4tty]

I've built one of these fancy showers too which had a hot and cold feed. Hot from the central heating, so flex will probably be ample. Do you have instructions or can you download it off Internet ?

 

[kme]

Guys: The O/P does say it has a steamer, which are generally electric - 2KW+ usually; although that still isn`t an excessive load, it is a bit much to bolt onto the nearest ring final.

O/P - if the shower isn`t on its own circuit, you don`t need figures for it.

If it is, and you are telling us that it is connected, by flex (what size flex??) onto a 2.5mm ring circuit....then you need to verify the integrity of the ring conductors, check the OCPD size, and check to see if the ring feeds anything else.

KME

 

[Kama]

Hi

Some where it does say that these units are to be wired separately, on own circuit, and first unit 100% rated, sure I read that somewhere.

Should read manufacturers instructions on installation.

 

[Theorysparky]

The way i would go

isolate shower,remove cover and ascertain power rating and cable size

If this is ok r1r2 test as normal from the shower

or am i missing something ??????

 

[Kama]

"hi guys going to do some testing on the circuits in my house next week , so i isolated the supply and removed the cover from my CU any way i have one of those fancy showers with the built in steamer , radio ect ,well this circuit seems to be on a ring with only the shower connected to it ,the problem i have is that when i pulled the shower out to see how its been connected it looks like who ever wired this has used a ring final then spured of this from a junction box using three core flex ,the wife says i cant lift up the carpet to confirm this because she says ill make to much mess anyway can i calculate r1+r2 from the open loops or shall i measure the r1+r2 from the panel that the flex is connected to "

For what reason are you doing r1+r2, these are ring main tests, these should be done at the fuse board.

What are you trying to determine, is this for a PIR, is it for a cert,

If the appliance has been spurred from the ring, from a joint box there should be an isolator, spur, double pole switch,

R1+R2 readings are readings from a fused supply to an appliance, to prove conformity, of the cct.

 

[Theorysparky]

For what reason are you doing r1+r2, these are ring main tests, these should be done at the fuse board.

What are you trying to determine, is this for a PIR, is it for a cert,

If the appliance has been spurred from the ring, from a joint box there should be an isolator, spur, double pole switch,

R1+R2 readings are readings from a fused supply to an appliance, to prove conformity, of the cct.

confused.com :C

 

[kme]

"For what reason are you doing r1+r2, these are ring main tests, these should be done at the fuse board.

Pardon? You have the unhappy distinction of making two statements in one sentence; both of which are inaccurate. Try to ensure you know what you`re talking about before posting your "facts" please.

What are you trying to determine, is this for a PIR, is it for a cert,

WHY does that matter? Would the readings be different?

If the appliance has been spurred from the ring, from a joint box there should be an isolator, spur, double pole switch,

Yippee. That`s generically correct.

R1+R2 readings are readings from a fused supply to an appliance, to prove conformity, of the cct.

WHAT???

From a fused supply to an appliance? So I could do one from the washing machine in the kitchen, to the fused spur it`s connected to at the wall, in order to fill in the "washing machine" appliance record on my cert.?

Conformity? Conformity to what? Elaboration would be appreciated.

Theo: conformity.com :C

 

[batty]

It all right he's just posting strange things to get his post count up once he gets to five things will change.

 

[butler26]

Im just doin some testing in my house to get used to testing the shower is on it's own ring and that im sure of and it's runing of the boiler I don't no why it's been wired of a ring it's not how I would of done it but on a ring u test r1+r2 at sockets as there is no sockets on this ring I'm asking should I test at the panel where the flex is wired in

 

[batty]

So is the shower one that heats water as it goes through ie 8.5 kw type or shower pump that takes it water from hot and cold water tanks?

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Im just doin some testing in my house to get used to testing the shower is on it's own ring and that im sure of and it's runing of the boiler I don't no why it's been wired of a ring it's not how I would of done it but on a ring u test r1+r2 at sockets as there is no sockets on this ring I'm asking should I test at the panel where the flex is wired in

You say it is a ring?

But no sockets?

how many other accessories are on the ring?

Or is it actually a radial made up of two parallel conductors to increase the capacity?

:C

 

[NozSpark]

If it is as you describe then it is not really a ring circuit,,, it is a radial circuit with parallel conductors

---------- Post Auto-Merged at 23:58 ---------- Previous post was made at 23:56 ----------

:coat

Specs beat me to it

 

[butler26]

The shower is not an electric shower it just needs power for radio light and steamer , I don't no if it's wired as a radial to increase the cable size and I no for sure there is nothing else wired to it

 

[Kama]

I read the Title R1 + R2, then the thread went on r1+r2. I always thought these are 2 different tests,

R1 + R2 test is the sum of the resistance of the line conductor R1 and the circuit protective conductor R2. 612.2.1 Note 1

r1 + r2 test, Final ring circuit test,

r1 = the line conductor of the ring end to end,

r2 = the protective conductor of the ring end to end,

rn = the neutral conductor of the ring end to end

r1 + r2 = fig 8 loop etc etc

There is a difference, I didnt know if the OP new that,

When doing R1 + R2 tests you can do that anywhee on the ring, but the results can be drastically affected by parellel paths, thats why its always best to test at the Fuse Board, circuit disconnected from the rest of the circuits, to try and eliminate possible parallel paths, perhaps I shouldnt have said should, albeit should is not always an obligation, but in this is instance a recommendation.

I asked the questions, of PIR or Cert, just to get some insight into the reasons for the tests, was there a fault, had there been some problems, was it due for an inspection, or had somebody done a cert/PIR and not happy with the results.

I dont remember stating these are facts, they are replies to an op in a forum, which people are looking for advise, assistance or different ideas, if you want hard facts, you shouldnt post on forums, you should get the app books, BS 7671, GN 3, OSG, even then, The regs book is only a rule of thumb.

Yippee. That`s generically correct. I am glad that you think that.

R1+R2 readings are readings from a fused supply to an appliance, to prove conformity, of the cct.

That should have been " accessory " R1+R2 readings are readings from a fused supply to an accessory, to prove conformity, of the cct.

R1+R2, of the circuit tested from the fuse board, which can be used to determine the earth loop impedance of the circuit, the highest reading on that circuit recorded and used on you certificate / Report, in schedule of results, to verify compliance with the loop impedance requirements of the regulations.

I have tried to explain my earlier posting, slightly more in depth than would normally be expected by most sparks, perhaps it was the way that I put them,

From a fused supply to an appliance? So I could do one from the washing machine in the kitchen, to the fused spur it`s connected to at the wall, in order to fill in the "washing machine" appliance record on my cert.?

Conformity? Conformity to what? Elaboration would be appreciated.

Thats what PAT is for appliances.

 

[Maplasterelec]

r2 is end to end of cpc on a ring final

rn is end to end of neutral on a ring final

 

[Kama]

Sorry about that, I have edited the post.

thank you