RCCB Tripping

[Steven Le]

Hey guys, sorry in advance if this is the wrong place to post as I'm new to the forums!

I seriously need help with my situation in which I will do my best to explain below: 

Basically my power keeps randomly cutting and when I check the fuse box I see that the RCCB has tripped off. I've done some research online to try and figure out the cause of this. 

What I've noticed is that: 

• Once the RCCB trips, I can turn it back on immediately and it won't trip again till later on in the day. 
  
• The amount of times it trips varies from 8 times a day to none at all. 
  
• It's an on going problem which seems to disappear on it's own and then reappear for a week or two and then disappear again.
  
• The times at which it trips varies as well, sometimes even whilst everyone in the household is asleep. 
  
• I've noticed it tripped once when I turned on the kettle but when I reset the RCCB the kettle worked fine and didn't trip again. 
  
• I've actually called out an engineer who basically said it would be detecive work and that it is most likely a faulty appliance. 
  
• To knowledge if it was a faulty appliance that was plugged in, if I was to reset the RCCB and the appliance was still plugged in it should just trip off again immediately but this doesn't seem to happen?
  

Any thoughts of advice would be very appreciated. From what I understand it doesn't seem to be a faulty appliance but I'm not too sure. I'm considering calling out another electricitan but the last one seemed adamant that it was a faulty appliance which I haven't been able to locate!

Thanks in advace!

 

[Blue Duck]

Sounds to me like water ingress or fauna, do you have outside lighting or a pond pump?

If it is an appliance unplug everything and see if it still happens?

 

[steptoe]

it could be any number of things,

but, from where I'm sitting I'd take a mad guess at cumulative leakage, that is tipped over the edge when something else is turned on,

ie, your kettle, fridge starting up, boiler firing etc,

thats why to you it seems random,

first off, you need a decent electrician that will carry out some basic testing that WILL narrow down the problem,

at the very least your first electrician should have done a test on your fixed wiring before simply blanket blaming your appliances,

 

[Steven Le]

Thanks for the responses guys, looks like I will need to contact an electrician again! 

I've considered unplugging everything in house but then I don't know how long to wait to see if it still trips since i'd have to turn of my fridges, etc it is inconvenient. 

I dont think it's a specific appliance that is faulty otherwise i'd assume that the switch would turn itself back off when I reset it if the appliance is still plugged in? 

 

[Sharpend]

Any appliances that have an element or motor in could be a likely culprit. Elements tend to breakdown after a period of time and subsequently cause a fault as described. Therefore look at all the appliances that are used both in kitchen and bedroom-think hair straighteners etc. 

Do you have any that are not reasonably new? (Although some new ones are faulty ask Hotpoint) 

consider the age of fridge and or freezer etc. It is also possible for boilers to cause a similar described problem so does it coincide with heating/time clock? 

 

[Revved Up Sparky]

first off, you need a decent electrician that will carry out some basic testing that WILL narrow down the problem,

at the very least your first electrician should have done a test on your fixed wiring before simply blanket blaming your appliances,

+1

A simple straightforward insulation resistance test on each final circuit should have been done which could have quickly eliminated the fixed wiring from the investigation.

As Blue Duck suggested, it's well worth taking a look at accessories which are at risk of water ingress such as outside lights which, in my experience, are a fairly common cause of RCD tripping issues during the Autumn and Winter when there is increased rainfall.

 

[Steven Le]

I do have two outside lights, one by the front door and one by the garden door. 

The one by the garden door no longer works though. 

What should I look for when checking the outside lights to see if it's the cause? 

Thanks again for all the responses!

 

[kerching]

The outside light that no longer works...is it totally disconnected OR just not working?

if still connected then that would be my first port of call

 

[Steven Le]

I don't think it's disconnected just stopped working awhile back.

 

[Murdoch]

The first thing the op should do is keep a diary for when it trips and see if there is any pattern.....

 

[ProDave]

+1 to get another electrician.

As well as blaming "your appliances" did he actually do ANY testing of the fixed wiring at all?  A decent electrician would be able to test your appliances as well to see if any of them have problems.

How old is the house? Last one like this I did, the tripping was cased by damp in the structure, in particular one socket I removed was literally dripping with water from either damp or condensation.
 

 

[Steven Le]

I've actually recently started keeping a record:

26/12/2016: 21:26

26/12/2016: 22:30

27/12/2016: 00:31 

27/12/2016: 13:02

27/12/2016: 14:08 

27/12/2016: 17:40 

27/12/2016: 19:42

I also noted down the things I was doing/the others in the household were doing but none of it seemed relevant i.e. lying in bed, using their smartphones, eating, etc. To be fair, certain things were on during these times such as tv's, wifi, fridge, etc. 

The engineer literally walked to my fuse box which is practically next to my front door whereby I showed him which switch was tripping and he basically said it's an appliance, either someone is plugging something in or it's something on a timer. Then he said I would have to do detective work to figure out which one it is. I didn't know any better as I hadn't done any research yet so I just went with this. Basically he didn't test anything at all, he didn't take out any equipment or anything, just looked at the fuse box to see which switch was tripping.

I've been trying to figure it out but I got confused when it trips and then when I turn it back on it stays on for awhile so I didn't know how to go around and test each appliance.

The house is roughly 18 years old (I moved in about 18 years ago and it was a new build)

 

[Murdoch]

It may not be an appliance. Did a job like this recently and tracked the problem to the live and earth crossing in a back box......

Any one simply blaming an appliance without doing any tests is misleading you imho

 

[Blue Duck]

Let's get this straight first before it gets out of hand...

The person who came and looked at your fuse box was NOT an engineer, he was a numpty and shall herein be referred to as numpty. If he was an electrician, numpty would have checked out the circuits before condemning the appliances.

I get this fairly frequently, where someone like numpty can't be bothered to fault find and jus blames the appliances and buggers off leaving the customer with the conundrum of what to replace first.

You have done the right thing by logging the instances and what you were doing at the time, that is very helpful for the next electrician.

good luck!

 

[Andy™]

so he didnt actually do any testing?

if its tripping on a regular basis like that then there should be some evidence of a fault on the circuit so should be easier to find than if it only trips occasionally

 

[ProDave]

Since he didn't do anything, I sincerely hope he didn't charge you for his pearls of wisdom.

The normal procedure is go round the house and unplug everything, and then test the circuits at the consumer unit That won't take long. If everything tests okay there then it's a case of test the appliances as you plug each one back in.  If he finds a fault then it's an unknown quantity how long it will take to find it.

In the mean time until you get a proper electrician back, try unplugging everything that is not actually in use.
 

 

[Steven Le]

All right guys, Thanks so much for all the responses, you've all been so helpful! I've decided to just arrange another engineer and this time thanks to all the info you've given I'll ensure this engineer actually runs some tests and does his/her job this time around! 

In the meantime, I've started to turn off appliances bit by bit and see if it still trips to start ruling stuff out! 

 

[Andy™]

In the meantime, I've started to turn off appliances bit by bit and see if it still trips to start ruling stuff out! 

turned off is not unplugged. big difference. especially when you are trying to find a fault

 

[Murdoch]

turned off is not unplugged. big difference. especially when you are trying to find a fault

Quite correct. Some sockets are only single pole switching which will not isolate the neutral and earth.....

 

[ProDave]

One question We should ask, and your sparky will ask if he is on the ball: "have you had ANY work done recently?"

One similar job after over an hour of tracing the fault, it boiled down to a lighting cable in the ceiling of the kitchen (single storey flat roof, no access to roof space)  It was only when I told her where the fault was she said "Oh we had the flat roof re felted last week"