rcd protection for bathroom spotlights

[soulman]

i am quoting for installing some downlights in a bathroom refurb. The bathroom lights have no rcd protection, what would be the easiest & cost effective way to protect my work with an rcd. i cannot put in a rcbo as ccu is too old. i was thinking of possible mounting an rcd enclosure next to consumer and run upstairs lighting through it. Any quick solutions

 

[M107]

rcd fused spur

or

rcd next to cu in it's own enclosure

 

[soulman]

Cheers for that, a rcd fused spur would keep the cost down, would it be o.k to install just after the junction box in the loft, so just protecting the feed to my spots, therefore any problems with the rest of the installation is not my concern.

cheers

 

[Sharpend]

Not ideal as PITA to reset, but providing you leave sufficient notices as to it's location then the choice is yours I guess.

Would be tempted to pop hole in ceiling outside above bathroom door and fix it there. More accessible to reset and test.

 

[M107]

If lighting circuits for up & down are seperated and load permits why not put it next to the cu?......

 

[Sharpend]

Because if there is a latent fault elsewhere in the circuit who do you think is going to get the blame when the rcd won't reset?

 

[soulman]

This has happened to me on more than one occassion where i have protected an entire circuit and had problems elsewhere.

Cheers chaps rcd fcu looks the quickest & cheapest option.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Because if there is a latent fault elsewhere in the circuit who do you think is going to get the blame when the rcd won't reset?

This has happened to me on more than one occassion where i have protected an entire circuit and had problems elsewhere.Cheers chaps rcd fcu looks the quickest & cheapest option.

Are we not going to be testing our circuit prior to doing the alterations and before re-enrgising.... :C

My BGB has a model MWC form on page 393 with a box headed Part 3 essential tests...

within that box are spaces for insulation test readings between...

Line/Neutral

Line/Earth

amd..

Neutral/Earth

If your Insulation resistance tests are above the minimum permissible...

I fail to see how you are going to get a resistance of somewhere as low as 8000ohms - 7666ohms ish to get a 30ma trip current flowing..???

There are thousands of homes around the country with a single front end 30ma RCD...

a lot installed since the late 70's early 80's.....

and they are not tripping every other week!!!

There really is a paranoia with sparks about RCDs tripping...

If there is a latent defect somewhere in on the circuit, who do you think will get the blame if the homeowner gets a shock from an unprotected part of the circuit??

Oh yeh mr customer will say...

thats the circuit the spark put the new lights onto last month!!

I though he was supposed to of tested it before he added onto the circuit :|

AND..

what do you do when called back in 4 months to stick some wall lights in the bedroom..

oh er!!!

we now need to stick another RCD in..

or undo part of our work we did last time!!!!

ALSO..

leaving an RCD half way down a circuit when it is just as easy to fit it by the CU just makes your insulation tests more of a PITA..

as you got to take it out of circuit... (or not do the full tests!)

Just do a proper job...

test the original circuit..

do the work..

leave a fully protected circuit



:C

just test the dam work properly and stick the RCD near the CU

 

[betty swollocks]

Technically isn't down lights wiring actually in the void above?

Wouldn't that make work not actually in any zone or in a bathroom?

Wouldn't that mean that there would be no new wiring buried in walls beneath plaster less than 50mm unless a new wall mounted switch was installed?

So would an rcd really be necessary?

Just me being picky

 

[lineman]

[

 

[Ash]

Location containing shower, RCD protection.

IP rated downlighters technically aren't required, but imo it's not a good idea to not have one above a shower with all that condensation.

Also, why not RCD at the CU? If there's a fault, bang, more work, more money.

You've not created a fault, you've found one that they didn't know was there.

 

[stan794]

What about the common scenario that I found myself in today, called to quote on 4 downlights, 3 broken, she wants them all replacing (in bathroom). She hands me some real budget lights that she has bought just connect them up she says. I said they are no good, you really want fire rated and ip rated, what's that she says I explain etc, also her cu is old wylex so I explained advantages of rcd. She then shows me the door, I was hoping for a price if about

 

[soulman]

special location i always test every circuit prior to connecting anything to it. The fault occured sometime later and my rcd was tripping. so i was to blame . Neither of the faults had anything to do with what i done, anyway i have read your post and your absolutely correct. it makes more sense to put the rcd next to the consumer. thank you

 

[Sharpend]

For clarification, I would always put the rcd at the front, however as I read the post Soul was looking at cheaper options and it had been suggested the use of a Rcd spur. I was only suggesting had if a spur was used then it would be best left accessible. As regard the testing, I was not suggesting that no testing should be undertaken, all I meant is that if you install the rcd spur at the point at which you interrupted the circuit the customer would not be able to pin a tripping rcd on you if another part of the circuit became a problem once you had left. Naturally any professional electrician would carry out the required testing and certification related to the work that they done. But we all know how customers try it on.

 

[steptoe]

you can only install what you are paid to install,

anything that comes later is priced accordingly

you do not worry about the next person to come along, it might not be you.

that may not be best practice, or how it 'should' be done, but its hard facts of life these days, cheapest safe way you can.

 

[PC Electrics]

As per usual Specs has hit the nail squarely on the head

Agree about this paranoia thing . It's very similar to what we experienced in the auto industry when airbags came in the. all the luddites predicted thousands would be killed by them . Fact is that rcds like airbags save lives

 

[Theorysparky]

just thinking of the cost

is there that much difference between an enclosure and a rcd fcu