Very odd goings on. Can you solve it?

[SimonW]

Sorry for the long one. 
 

Hi. I have just installed a garage consumer unit in my shed with a 40a 30mA RCD, a 32a MCB and 1 x 6a MCB (The BG 5 module one out of Screwfix) I ran 6mm swa cable approximately 35m from the main board in the house. I’ve wired up a ring in the shed and switched it all on. No problems. I plug a radio in and switch it on, as soon as I draw any power, the RCD in the shed only trips. It happens on every socket outlet. I’ve checked for damage to the cables, checked that I’ve got the polarity correct in the outlets, checked for continuity on the live, neutral and earth, checked for leakage, but there’s nothing wrong with the circuit?!?! 

So I then took everything out of the MCBs and wired in a single socket just loose hanging from the consumer unit. I turned it all back on, plugged in a small sander (the only thing I had handy) and the second I switched the sander on, the RCD trips. At least I now know there is nothing wrong with the sheds wiring. So that’s a positive. Lol. 

Back in the house the swa goes into the split load fuse board via a 32a MCB. There is a 100a RCD protecting my shed circuit and 4 others (2x32a and 2x6a) just sockets and lights on that side, nothing big. I’ve wired the 6mm SWA into the correct neutral and earth bars in the consumer unit. 

Any thoughts what is causing this? Could the RCD in the house and the RCD in the shed be working against each other? I know you don’t really need 2 RCD’s, but I was thinking that if there was a fault in the shed, it would trip that out and leave the house alone. 

This is really doing my head in. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance. Si 

 

[NozSpark]

You don't want to hear this, but you've connected it up wrong

What tests have you carried out to ensure the safety of this addition?

 

[SimonW]

Hi, thanks for the reply. No tests yet. I don’t have the test equipment, I’m having someone test it for me. 
 

Please tell me what I’ve done wrong, that’s why I’m here

 

[Geoff1946]

Absolute guess?  A neutral to earth short in the shed wiring. Could be wiring error or damage such as catching a neutral with a plate screw.

 

[Murdoch]

Hi, thanks for the reply. No tests yet. I don’t have the test equipment, I’m having someone test it for me. 
 

Please tell me what I’ve done wrong, that’s why I’m here

On ALL new installs or additions to existing installations DEAD tests are conducted before connecting to a live supply, but as you haven't done that.... 

So its virtually impossible to say whats wrong and you appear to have a spark coming to test so maybe tell them whats happened and see what they find.

BTW it you are in England or Wales this work falls under Part P of the building regs too

 

[ProDave]

Post a picture of your consumer unit wiring.  You will probably have to upload the picture to an image hosting site and post a link to it. 

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Hi, thanks for the reply. No tests yet. I don’t have the test equipment, I’m having someone test it for me. 
 

Please tell me what I’ve done wrong, that’s why I’m here

:shakehead

Any thoughts what is causing this? Could the RCD in the house and the RCD in the shed be working against each other? I know you don’t really need 2 RCD’s, but I was thinking that if there was a fault in the shed, it would trip that out and leave the house alone. 

This is really doing my head in. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance. Si 

Designed it wrong....

failed to test it correctly prior to energising...

Talk of 100a RCD's suggests you are working well out of your depth...

and you clearly don't understand how they work!

Safest advice..

Leave well alone..

await someone competent to correctly test & re-energise the installation..

Who is issuing the Electrical installation certificate..

and signing the declaration boxes for design, install & test?

:C   

 

[Badger]

:shakehead

Designed it wrong....

failed to test it correctly prior to energising...

Talk of 100a RCD's suggests you are working well out of your depth...

and you clearly don't understand how they work!

Safest advice..

Leave well alone..

await someone competent to correctly test & re-energise the installation..

Who is issuing the Electrical installation certificate..

and signing the declaration boxes for design, install & test?

:C   

What's an eicr and eic mate :ill get my

 

[SimonW]

What's an eicr and eic mate :ill get my

“Designed it wrong?” Have you been round? I must’ve missed it. 
 

“Failed to test?” It’s perfectly fine to check before testing. You’re just being pedantic. 
 

“Talk of 100a RCD”. big whoop, I miss typed. I’m well aware that it should’ve been an 63a, but it was late and I was tired when I wrote it. You knew exactly what I meant. More unnecessary pedantry. 
 

“Who’s issuing the Cert?” It certainly won’t be you. 
 

Safest advice: Maybe you need to re read the name of this forum. Y’know, it’s called the “Do it yourself, the electrical forum” “The UK’s FRIENDLIEST electrical forum” 
 

f-ing keyboard warrior.
 

Thanks to the others who replied and didn’t feel the need to be a **** like badger. It was appreciated  

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

“Designed it wrong?” Have you been round? I must’ve missed it. 
 

“Failed to test?” It’s perfectly fine to check before testing. You’re just being pedantic. 
 

“Talk of 100a RCD”. big whoop, I miss typed. I’m well aware that it should’ve been an 63a, but it was late and I was tired when I wrote it. You knew exactly what I meant. More unnecessary pedantry. 
 

“Who’s issuing the Cert?” It certainly won’t be you. 
 

Safest advice: Maybe you need to re read the name of this forum. Y’know, it’s called the “Do it yourself, the electrical forum” “The UK’s FRIENDLIEST electrical forum” 
 

f-ing keyboard warrior.
 

Thanks to the others who replied and didn’t feel the need to be a **** like badger. It was appreciated  

63a RCD??     :shakehead    I stand by my earlier statement you clearly lack understanding of RCD's

and are working out of your depth..  

Not pedantic...

Just offering thoughts that you asked for as to why you are struggling to resolve your problem..

i.e.  you should have.....

Design your alteration..   (ensuring all appropriate protective devices and cable sizes are selected)

Install your new cables etc..

Do DEAD tests..  (As per BS7671 wiring regulations)..

If dead tests are satisfactory, then you can look at energising the new alterations.

then you do your Live tests..

(And then document them onto the appropriate electrical certificate..

and if this new circuit is in England or Wales, you would then also notify it for Part-P building regulations compliance..)

had you done this..  you wouldn't have the problem you now have!!!

Just because you are posting a question in the DIY section,

doesn't mean standard industry guidance  no longer applies..

Or that it will prevent electricity from causing serious or fatal injury to a healthy adult in less than half a second....

I repeat:  Safest advice..

Leave well alone..

await someone competent to correctly test & re-energise the installation..

 

[SimonW]

63a RCD??     :shakehead    I stand by my earlier statement you clearly lack understanding of RCD's

and are working out of your depth..  

Not pedantic...

Just offering thoughts that you asked for as to why you are struggling to resolve your problem..

i.e.  you should have.....

Design your alteration..   (ensuring all appropriate protective devices and cable sizes are selected)

Install your new cables etc..

Do DEAD tests..  (As per BS7671 wiring regulations)..

If dead tests are satisfactory, then you can look at energising the new alterations.

then you do your Live tests..

(And then document them onto the appropriate electrical certificate..

and if this new circuit is in England or Wales, you would then also notify it for Part-P building regulations compliance..)

had you done this..  you wouldn't have the problem you now have!!!

Just because you are posting a question in the DIY section,

doesn't mean standard industry guidance  no longer applies..

Or that it will prevent electricity from causing serious or fatal injury to a healthy adult in less than half a second....

I repeat:  Safest advice..

Leave well alone..

await someone competent to correctly test & re-energise the installation..

You didn’t offer thoughts. You made pissy comments. Thoughts would’ve been “have you checked this” or “have you considered that” those are thoughts. 
 

I’m not sure what you’re on about? Have you never seen a 63a RCD? Go to Google and type in MK7860s. They come in the Sentry Consumer Unit. Jeez, and I’m supposed to be thick?
 

My design is perfectly fine, it was given to me by my NIC EIC qualified electrician. The same one who will be checking my work, testing it and to use you’re wankey quote “documenting them onto the appropriate electrical certificate“ What do you thinking I’m using for cable, strawberry laces? Stop talking rubbish. 

Anyway, I’ve sorted it all out now please feel free to jog on. 
 

don’t bother replying again. I won’t read it. 
 

 

[Sharpend]

I’m still amused as to why, if it was designed by an NIC electrician, said electrician wasn’t called to assist with failed install? 
 

throwing abuse at qualified persons is unnecessary as it seeks to achieve nothing only open yourself to expose your lack of understanding. 
 

your idea of thoughts is my idea of spoon feeding, try asking a solicitor to spoon feed or their thoughts and they’ll charge you £230 per hour. But I guess you wouldn’t hurl abuse from behind a keyboard at them either. 

 

[Murdoch]

You didn’t offer thoughts. You made pissy comments. Thoughts would’ve been “have you checked this” or “have you considered that” those are thoughts. 
 

I’m not sure what you’re on about? Have you never seen a 63a RCD? Go to Google and type in MK7860s. They come in the Sentry Consumer Unit. Jeez, and I’m supposed to be thick?
 

My design is perfectly fine, it was given to me by my NIC EIC qualified electrician. The same one who will be checking my work, testing it and to use you’re wankey quote “documenting them onto the appropriate electrical certificate“ What do you thinking I’m using for cable, strawberry laces? Stop talking rubbish. 

Anyway, I’ve sorted it all out now please feel free to jog on. 
 

don’t bother replying again. I won’t read it. 
 

so you come here for help and start chucking insults at members …… not an ideal approach imho

do let us know what the NICEIC spark says - assuming he actually exists, and for the record the NICEIC don’t have a 3rd party system IIRC

 

[kerching]

So go on then....what was the fault?

my money is on neutral/earth fault OR N in wrong terminal at board end

 

[Murdoch]

“Failed to test?” It’s perfectly fine to check before testing. You’re just being pedantic. 

Sorry mate, but without proper test kit and competence you can't possibly know if its perfectly fine - which you know is wrong as the RCD is tripping.

I'll get my coat too

 

[Badger]

“Designed it wrong?” Have you been round? I must’ve missed it. 
 

“Failed to test?” It’s perfectly fine to check before testing. You’re just being pedantic.
When Contractors (AKA ELECTRICIANS) put a new installation in to a building or premises so that people and equipement can use the supply SAFELY Any decent ELECTRICIAN would test the installation to make sure the Wiring was correct and safe to use and wont cause an issue. Also How do you think it takes many years for QUALIFIED ELECTRICIANS to be able t their job in the industry, thats the same as doing your own brakes, then loading the car for your holiday without taking the car for a test drive even mechanics check the work before handing back a vehicle to its keeper or owner they DONT just GUESS with a thought of IF IT GOES BANG THEN ITS A PROBLEM, TESTING IS A BIG PART OF OUR WORK DAY TO DAY YOU should REMEMBER  that.

“Talk of 100a RCD”. big whoop, I miss typed. I’m well aware that it should’ve been an 63a, but it was late and I was tired when I wrote it. You knew exactly what I meant. More unnecessary pedantry. 
 

“Who’s issuing the Cert?” It certainly won’t be you. 
 

Safest advice: Maybe you need to re read the name of this forum. Y’know, it’s called the “Do it yourself, the electrical forum” “The UK’s FRIENDLIEST electrical forum” 
 

f-ing keyboard warrior.
 

Thanks to the others who replied and didn’t feel the need to be a **** like badger. It was appreciated  

MAte i was replying to spec locations comment about a joke in general that wasnt aimed at you i hope you get your DIY install sorted out because a professional electrical contractor  would not put an installation in WITHOUT testing an install first using a correct tester, ( and yes i can comment on correct test equipment because im a QUALIFIED ELECTRICIAN not a DIYER Regards and wishing you well 

 

[Badger]

“Designed it wrong?” Have you been round? I must’ve missed it. 
 

“Failed to test?” It’s perfectly fine to check before testing. You’re just being pedantic. 
 

“Talk of 100a RCD”. big whoop, I miss typed. I’m well aware that it should’ve been an 63a, but it was late and I was tired when I wrote it. You knew exactly what I meant. More unnecessary pedantry. 
 

“Who’s issuing the Cert?” It certainly won’t be you. 
 

Safest advice: Maybe you need to re read the name of this forum. Y’know, it’s called the “Do it yourself, the electrical forum” “The UK’s FRIENDLIEST electrical forum” 
 

f-ing keyboard warrior.
 

Thanks to the others who replied and didn’t feel the need to be a **** like badger. It was appreciated  

AN appology should in order as i was quoting Spec Locs having a joke with spec loc not with yourself. 

 

[kerching]

Children children children. Put your big boys pants on and chill the grape down

it wasnt tested

there's a fault

 

[steptoe]

Well, 

I have googled, and googled , and googled, and googled, and used lots of other search engines as well, 

And, 

I still have no idea what an NICEIC qualified electrician is, 

I'd be very grateful if anyone could enlighten me, please. 

 

[Murdoch]

I met one last week (he had it on his Tee Shirt), he was telling me and a customer loads of stuff, the customer was enthralled, I just kept quiet thinking....... Really........

Did the T shirt have his name on the back?

Mr Richard Head?