Looped in ceiling rise - adding junction box/spur

[Scatts570]

Hi all,

I’ve fitted some Ikea light activated wardrobe lights and fed the cables through the ceiling into the loft. The lights are 24v dc and are fed by an Ikea 240v ac transformer. They are switched on by a photovoltaic sensor. My thought was to cut the plug off the transformer and wire into the existing lighting circuit at a junction box in the loft. There’s no JB’s as it’s looped in at the ceiling rose.

My question is, can I just cut the cable and fit a junction box in line and spur off to the wardrobe lights so I have a permanent live to them?

My gut says yes, but whilst I did electrics in my youth on aircraft, I’m not familiar with domestic regs.

Would appreciate some clarity on this.

 

[roys]

Yip what you are proposing all sounds good to me, providing it is all done to a good standard, for example earth sleaving used, no single insulation outside the box, connections good with no exposed copper, I like the box secured and labelled.
I have just done a similar thing to upgrade my bathroom electrics as I have added a fan and a heated mirror.
Safe working practice as well obviously like isolation of circuit before working on it.

 

[Scatts570]

Yip what you are proposing all sounds good to me, providing it is all done to a good standard, for example earth sleaving used, no single insulation outside the box, connections good with no exposed copper, I like the box secured and labelled.
I have just done a similar thing to upgrade my bathroom electrics as I have added a fan and a heated mirror.
Safe working practice as well obviously like isolation of circuit before working on it.

Thanks Roys. I was 90% sure, but always worth checking with the experts in case I’ve missed something.

 

[ProDave]

Just in case the lights ever go wrong and a point of isolation, why not instead do as you suggest but instead of a junction box, fit a 5A 3 pin socket and plug the lights into that with a 5A plug?

 

[binky]

Just in case the lights ever go wrong and a point of isolation, why not instead do as you suggest but instead of a junction box, fit a 5A 3 pin socket and plug the lights into that with a 5A plug?

Or just fit a normal single socket, so no cutting off plug and invalidating the warranty.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Hi all,

My question is, can I just cut the cable and fit a junction box in line and spur off to the wardrobe lights so I have a permanent live to them?

Sounds a perfectly reasonable method to me?

The only word of caution when extending off looped in & out lighting circuits..
Is make sure you have correctly identify a permanent live cable..
Not Live & Switched live cable looping off to a light switch..

I have had to correct DIY alterations before where a customer had tried to supply a new light off a switch cable..
mistakenly assuming that all cables had a live and neutral!

Side Note:-
If you are not aware, WAGO connectors are your best friend when doing wiring alterations..
e.g. https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Manufacturers/Wago_Connectors/Wago/index.html
(numerous other suppliers are also available.. google is your other friend)

But basically don't faff around with outdated screw-terminal junction boxes!

 

[Scatts570]

Good point Special Location. Had a Quick Look last night and it looked like the switched live cable was a smaller diameter, but didn’t look in any great detail. I’ll make sure it’s a rose to rose cable.
I’ll have a look at the Wago type connects. It’s just a have a couple of these essentials terminal junction boxes in my garage, so thought I’d make use of them.
https://www.screwfix.com/p/essentia...MIzKPpipOHjAMVkolQBh2XcAJmEAQYAiABEgKGnPD_BwE

 

[Fleeting]

That is not suitable for the connection of a flexible cord it offers no cable restraint.

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

It’s just a have a couple of these essentials terminal junction boxes in my garage, so thought I’d make use of them.
https://www.screwfix.com/p/essentia...MIzKPpipOHjAMVkolQBh2XcAJmEAQYAiABEgKGnPD_BwE

Those type of boxes are rubbish.. a lot of faff and time consuming>
I would never recommend anyone uses them if they are hoping to get a good electrically secure joint..

The screw threads in the terminals are often very poor quality,
and as fleeting said they have no cable restraint to stop the joints pulling apart,

So if using them you do need to be very thorough with finding a good location to fix the box and clipping your cables either side of the joint.!

 

[mindthegoat]

Or just fit a normal single socket, so no cutting off plug and invalidating the warranty.

Because someone will go up in the loft in winter and plug a heater into the socket.

 

[roys]

Because someone will go up in the loft in winter and plug a heater into the socket.

Put a socket off the lighting circuit up loft many times, used to be for Ariel boosters now it tends to be for cctv recorders or led wall wart type drivers. I put a label on it saying low power use only 6A max.
What’s the worst that can happen, the MCB trips,

 

[nicebutdim]

Put a socket off the lighting circuit up loft many times, used to be for Ariel boosters now it tends to be for cctv recorders or led wall wart type drivers. I put a label on it saying low power use only 6A max.
What’s the worst that can happen, the MCB trips,

Issue here is that you now have someone trying to get out of a loft in the dark, with a better chance than before of breaking their neck in the process. Using the upstairs lighting circuit for an aerial booster is certainly very common, but not something I'm generally comfortable with. I can see why it happened as an addition on older properties, but there's no reason for doing this in new builds as its poor design. 99 times out of 100 it's a double socket that gets fitted, without any form of labelling, leaving a convenient outlet.

 

[binky]

Because someone will go up in the loft in winter and plug a heater into the socket.

Oh all the crazy things I've encountered, that isn't one of them