12v Vs 230v downlights

[monkey5]

im installing about 20 downlights in a rewire but customer has mentioned using 12v coz there alot cheaper to run.

but im not 100% sure how much more efficient 12v are over 230v,

so was after others advice/opinions,

also are 12v counted towards the 3 in 4 lights needed in building regs?

thanks wayne

 

[Andy™]

50w is 50w, no matter if 12V or 230V

if anything, ELV can be more expensive due to heat losses in transformer & flex between transformer & lights (more current flowing though similar sized cable to normal LV)

personally, i would go with 230v. no transformer to go wrong, and GU10 connectors are much better than MR16

12v does not count towards your 3 of 4. only energy efficient do. ie CFL/LED etc

 

[NozSpark]

Watts is watts mate,, no matter what the voltage!

IMHO 12v (MR16) give a whiter, brighter light than 230v (GU10)

Unfortunately neither of them count towards the 3 in 4 for the building regs,,, that's why I'm installing Kosnic 4w LEDs in an extension when I 2nd fix it (GU10 fittings) - although they are

 

[PC Electrics]

im installing about 20 downlights in a rewire but customer has mentioned using 12v coz there alot cheaper to run. This is an urban mythbut im not 100% sure how much more efficient 12v are over 230v,

so was after others advice/opinions,

also are 12v counted towards the 3 in 4 lights needed in building regs? No

thanks wayne

230v for me, no Tx to go wrong.

 

[monkey5]

cheers guys its what i thought but had doubts when he mentioned that another spark had told him its a lot cheaper, so thought i best double check before i try to argue it.

are the 4w leds light any good as would recommend them if they are.

 

[NozSpark]

Not fitted them myself before, but side by side in the wholesalers thay do seem to be just as bright and they will satisfy the LABC

 

[Doc Hudson]

cheers guys its what i thought but had doubts when he mentioned that another spark had told him its a lot cheaper, so thought i best double check before i try to argue it. are the 4w leds light any good as would recommend them if they are.

You could explain to your customer that the units for calculating their electricity bill use kilo watt hours and if they had four 50watt lamps in the kitchen switched on for 5 hours that is equal to 1 kilo watt hour (50x4x5). Maybe the other spark was talking about lower wattage but the customer got confused? four 35watt lamps could stay on over 7hours. 35x4x7 = 0.98 Kilo watt hour.

Doc H.

 

[PC Electrics]

No. Believe it or not, there are people out there (some sparks included) who actually believe they really do use less electricity because the voltage is only 12 volts !!!!

 

[Andy™]

i can easily believe that!

 

[Sidewinder]

I know of one who could not work out the volt drop problem he had on his LV downlighters supplied from a single transformer, so lord knows what size cable he had put in, 1mm sq I believe, don't know the exact spec but there were about 48 of them in 4 banks of 12 off 4 transformers individually switched.

Kept well away from that one!

 

[col]

cheers guys its what i thought but had doubts when he mentioned that another spark had told him its a lot cheaper, so thought i best double check before i try to argue it. are the 4w leds light any good as would recommend them if they are.

Yep, 4W kosnics are good, I put blue ones in a bathroom and 'warm white' ones in a kitchen. Customer was very happy with both types. If in doubt about their brightness, maybe quote for a few more units than you would halogens so they're closer together, seemed fine to me tho.

 

[davetheglitz]

230v every time as it allows upgrade to LED's when the price comes down. 12v transformers are electronic and don't generally like loads below 20W. With LED's they tend to start flashing.

12 v makes sense in bathrooms where no RCD is in circuit - argument is that there is no 230v lighting in the bathroom. 230v wiring is above.

Light blue touchpaper.......

 

[Ash]

I always assumed 12V was introduced because of no RCDs, 12V just seems annoying now with transformers etc.

LED all the way anyway

 

[mapleford]

Morning All,

I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings but.... The domestic building service compliance guide 2010 (runs alongside building regs giving figures to work to) says 3 in 4 fittings have to be energy efficient (more than 45 lumens per watt) BUT fittings less than 5 watts don't count! A little thought.. if you light a room with 4 watt leds is it in fact lit at all? Anyway you can't count them in your 3 in 4.

Sorry

 

[kme]

Then fit the 5 watt variants (think some come in a GZ10 package?) - compliance achieved.

OR - if they say "fittings" - well they`re rated higher than 5W; they simply have a reduced wattage lamp installed

KME

 

[sparkytim]

Morning All,I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings but.... The domestic building service compliance guide 2010 (runs alongside building regs giving figures to work to) says 3 in 4 fittings have to be energy efficient (more than 45 lumens per watt) BUT fittings less than 5 watts don't count! A little thought.. if you light a room with 4 watt leds is it in fact lit at all? Anyway you can't count them in your 3 in 4.

Sorry

Umm that should be GLAD TIDINGS

Less then 5 watts are not included in the COUNT of fittings because they are SO EFFICIENT

You can have as many as you like

 

[mapleford]

If you put in 16 fittings, 4 have incandescent lamps fitted and the rest have 4w LEDs you don't comply with the regs as the 4w LEDs don't count on your 3 in 4. Regs should look at the installation (by the book) and say you need to change 3 of the incandescent lamps for low energy! When these were written it wasn't envisaged 4w LEDs would be bright enough for lighting a room.(Remember it takes an age to get these things approved and LED tech has motored on in that time)