1st fix, 2nd fix and some guidence needed please :)

[Nick182]

hey guys,

I might cop some flack over this but I put the word out via email asking for more experience in the field and after much effort i got a response. A guy has asked me to do second fix of a new build in a block of apartmets pretty much by myself. I dont want to look bad or stuff up. I want to be prepared and do a decent job.

Anyways ill cut to the chase.

I havnt been in the game all that long and would like to know what does 2nd fix actually mean? From what i gather its termination of cables and such. Is there anything else involved? Like testing and the issue of certificates?

Im quite nervous and i dont want to make anyone look bad, including myself.

What should i be prepared for exactly?

Im hoping someone can look over the fact that im no genius and havnt been in the game that long.

I hope someone can help me out...

thanks in advance.

Nick

 

[DJLSparks]

Hi Nick,

I'm assuming you haven't been to college? Have no electrical qualifications or experience?....

 

[Nick182]

yeh ive got some electrical experience on the domestic side of things. Im going to college to do the domestic installers course next month. ive also done my 17th edition and just done the part p course not to long ago.

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

Well it sounds like your really out of your depth. Rather than co*k it up or loose the work do you know any sparks that will do the work, with you helping and split the profit.

 

[Robin Spark]

Hi Nick,

have you seen this guy and the apartments to know whats involved and what has happened to the original sparks who done the first fix or is it this guy who done the first fix?

Also, dont mean to sound bad, but I wouldnt let a total stranger to do a 2nd fix for me unless I checked him out properly, was recommended and I accompanied him on his first day. Just beware thats all and make sure you know all of the facts.

 

[betty swollocks]

Streeeeewth

 

[Andy™]

hey guys,I might cop some flack over this but I put the word out via email asking for more experience in the field and after much effort i got a response. A guy has asked me to do second fix of a new build in a block of apartmets pretty much by myself. I dont want to look bad or stuff up. I want to be prepared and do a decent job.

Anyways ill cut to the chase.

I havnt been in the game all that long and would like to know what does 2nd fix actually mean? From what i gather its termination of cables and such. Is there anything else involved? Like testing and the issue of certificates?

Im quite nervous and i dont want to make anyone look bad, including myself.

What should i be prepared for exactly?

Im hoping someone can look over the fact that im no genius and havnt been in the game that long.

I hope someone can help me out...

thanks in advance.

Nick

you clearly have no idea what you are doing. best thing to do is go play with some AA batteries and work your way up from that.

and yor post reads as though you think I&T is optional? well its not.

how do you plan on complying with part p of building regs? even if your registered with a scam provider (unlikely, unless youve paid some bribes), you cant notify the job since you didnt first fix it (thats installing teh cables, incase your stuck)

and finally, why isnt the spark who done the first fix not doing second fix? not paid by builder?

 

[ProDave]

This old chestnut comes up from time to time.

The only correct way is a 3 part EIC with you signing construction, inspection and test, and the original spark signing design.

I think i would have to be pretty desperate to take that on myself, it's one huge can of worms. I would want to know a LOT about who first fixed, and WHY he wasn't finishing the job.

 

[Nick182]

yea its all good. i can do the work.. but what's involved with doing a second fix? Will I have to do testing and filling out certificates? I can imagine that he would be doing the certs while i just finish off the cables and sockets etc?

 

[Andy™]

yea its all good. i can do the work.. but what's involved with doing a second fix? Will I have to do testing and filling out certificates? I can imagine that he would be doing the certs while i just finish off the cables and sockets etc?

if A N other is doing certs, then why are you doing second fix? an d if you dont even know what it is, how can you do it?

 

[Evans Electric]

Who is the "Guy" who is asking you finish the job ?

As said, new apartments will be under building control so who signs the EIC .

Also , 2nd fixing another's work can be a nightmare. We've done it twice over the years , builder begged us to 2nd fix 10 houses , can't get original sparks back (never found out why) When we started we realised there was something wrong with the cable, you could crumble off the insulation between thumb and forfinger. We walked off until they agreed to pay us to rewire them all .

Other job was an extension to a sheltered housing unit, whoever 1st fixed had , in numerous places, cut through one side of the T/E and pushed it down the metal sheathing or cut right off both ring legs (under sheathing ) but left two 1 mtr lengths continuing to the box .

All rady to be plastered over.

All photographed by the builder's solicitor ( never knew the outcome)

Talking of that job reminded me that the drugs squad used to join us on site , dressed as builders, had a video cam. set up to nail the local dealers opposite.

Again I digress.

 

[Nick182]

sorry i shouldnt of asked.

thanks for the help. I guess

 

[Sidewinder]

This old chestnut comes up from time to time.The only correct way is a 3 part EIC with you signing construction, inspection and test, and the original spark signing design.

I think i would have to be pretty desperate to take that on myself, it's one huge can of worms. I would want to know a LOT about who first fixed, and WHY he wasn't finishing the job.

Dave,

I'm not sure how you can sign for construction if you are only 2nd fixing?

IMHO to sign for construction you would have to 1st & 2nd fix, else how can you tick that all the cables are visually inspected upon installation to show no damage, and that they are all run in the correct routes?

 

[wozz]

To me just sounds like hes been asked by another electrician to do some second fixing, he says by email we need to know exactly what hes been asked to do before hes hung out to dry over signing a EIC which hes hasnt done. Just the way i see it.

 

[Evans Electric]

yea its all good. i can do the work.. but what's involved with doing a second fix? Will I have to do testing and filling out certificates? I can imagine that he would be doing the certs while i just finish off the cables and sockets etc?

OK Nick , you say you are happy taking it on . A 2nd fix consists of fitting all the accessories , fit and connect the C/U then test it and certify it.

From your post I assume that the "Guy" is an electrician , so you will be the hired help ,make sure you are no more than that.

Get some stuff made clear before you start.

1. He is paying you to fit some accessories and a board. ( for some reason he can't do it himself)

2. He will be testing and signing it off , not you . ( Not your concern , you are the hired help)

3. He will be supplying the gear .

4. You make it plain to the "Guy" that you are a learner .

5. Never "imagine " what some of these "Guys" are going to do ( as in "he will be doing the certs)

6 And while I'm at it , never imagine that he 'll pay you either.

 

[Robin Spark]

To me this sounds like another spark, using Nick for a bit of cheap labour to finish the second fix. Other spark will be fully responsible for signing certs and should have a full overview of the work carried out. No-one else will probably know poor Nick was ever there!

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

hey guys,I might cop some flack over this but I put the word out via email asking for more experience in the field and after much effort i got a response. A guy has asked me to do second fix of a new build in a block of apartmets pretty much by myself. I dont want to look bad or stuff up. I want to be prepared and do a decent job.

Anyways ill cut to the chase.

I havnt been in the game all that long and would like to know what does 2nd fix actually mean? From what i gather its termination of cables and such. Is there anything else involved? Like testing and the issue of certificates?

Im quite nervous and i dont want to make anyone look bad, including myself.

What should i be prepared for exactly?

Im hoping someone can look over the fact that im no genius and havnt been in the game that long.

I hope someone can help me out...

thanks in advance.

Nick

I personally wouldn't be asking a bunch of strangers on a forum who have no dealings with the job.....

I would be asking the guy who has contacted you exactly what he wants you to do....

and how much you are getting paid for it....

and if you have to supply any materials...

e.g.

2nd' fix 20 double sockets could be..

20 metal back boxes screwed to the walls...

or 40 ends of T&E poking out of Stud walls....

One mans 2nd fix is another mans 2nd fix + or - a bit!

p.s.

If you are joining a load of sockets on a ring...

How will you be able to tell 'Mr Guy' that you have done it all if you haven't confirmed that the ring is continuous..

And correct polarity??

:|

YOU ARE ASKING IN THE WRONG PLACE.....

 

[ProDave]

Dave,I'm not sure how you can sign for construction if you are only 2nd fixing?

IMHO to sign for construction you would have to 1st & 2nd fix, else how can you tick that all the cables are visually inspected upon installation to show no damage, and that they are all run in the correct routes?

Yes I pondered that.

Perhaps you should BOTH sign for construction as you both did a bit?

As I said, can of worms.

 

[Nick182]

OK Nick , you say you are happy taking it on . A 2nd fix consists of fitting all the accessories , fit and connect the C/U then test it and certify it. From your post I assume that the "Guy" is an electrician , so you will be the hired help ,make sure you are no more than that.

Get some stuff made clear before you start.

1. He is paying you to fit some accessories and a board. ( for some reason he can't do it himself)

2. He will be testing and signing it off , not you . ( Not your concern , you are the hired help)

3. He will be supplying the gear .

4. You make it plain to the "Guy" that you are a learner .

5. Never "imagine " what some of these "Guys" are going to do ( as in "he will be doing the certs)

6 And while I'm at it , never imagine that he 'll pay you either.

Exactly the info i was after. Whether or not he does the testing and/or the certs.

I will be speaking with him over the course of the next few days to get a clearer idea of what needs to be done.. It wont be for a while until im on site.

Hes currently got 2 sites on the go. The work will involve 2nd fixing flats while on paid work.

Hes happy to give me the experience and im happy to take it.

thanks mate much appreciated.

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[quote name='Andy

 

[batty]

I really am not sure if this is a wind up a joke or what. You are telling us you are a sparks or training to be a sparks but don't know what first and second fix is. I would think it may be an idea to get some experience in the industry before working on your own.