Advice wanted re new boiler and shower please

[goalattacker]

Hello, I am planning to have a new bathroom installed - bath, with wall shower, sink and toilet. My problem is about the shower. I currently have a really pathetic (non-electric) shower, the water pressure is rubbish (although its quite good from the taps). I have been given all sorts of advice and dont know what to do.

I have a water tank and boiler that heats up the water. I would like to get rid of tank and have a boiler where I have hot water all the time without having to heat it up however have been told I have to have this put in before dealing with my shower issue - is this correct? If I have the shower put in before a new boiler will it still work with a new boiler - and what sort of shower should I have? An electric shower or should I get a pump installed - can a pump be used with both types of boilers. Arghhh, its all so confusing for someone who hasnt got a clue with these things - . thank you for any help.

 

[NozSpark]

GA

The advice that you have been given is correct. The new combination boiler will give you hot water at the same pressure as your cold, so your shower should improve.

 

[tom1]

dont think you can have a shower pump with a combi it would have to be a mixer shower

 

[dave2]

GAThe advice that you have been given is correct. The new combination boiler will give you hot water at the same pressure as your cold, so your shower should improve.

Remember that pressure and flow are different. Flushing toilets and running other outlets at the same time as showereing will have an adverse effect on shower performance.

 

[NozSpark]

Remember that pressure and flow are different. Flushing toilets and running other outlets at the same time as showereing will have an adverse effect on shower performance.

But that happens with ANY shower that is plumbed directly off the H&C, the only way around this is to use a pumped mixer shower that's fed from the HW cyl and CW header tank

 

[m4tty]

Someone told me recently that salamander do a pump for a combi boiler ?

 

[kme]

But that happens with ANY shower that is plumbed directly off the H&C, the only way around this is to use a pumped mixer shower that's fed from the HW cyl and CW header tank

Not if you have an unvented cylinder from a system boiler, and a decent wax cylinder type mixer shower - it`ll deal with pressure differentials on its own, if its a good`un

 

[MSH1601]

So after all that.. Get your boiler sorted first, then look at the options of either an electric shower fed off cold feed only, or shower valve fed from hot and cold supply (preferably thermostatic valve). If you pay out for a pump now, could be a complete waste of money when boiler upgraded to combi cause pump may draw hot from boiler too fast or pressure of hot from boiler may be too much for pump, either way combi hot doesn't require pump.

 

[goalattacker]

Hi, thanks all for your responses - really pleased that you have taken the time to reply to try and help me.

So, boiler fitted first (bummer cos dead expensive!!) and then probably an electric shower. At least I know not to go for a pump.

Thanks again, very much appreciated and Im definitely a little wiser than a few hours ago

 

[NozSpark]

Well,, the thing is by changing the boiler you might not need to change the shower.

But there is nothing stoping you doing it the other way around

 

[tom1]

if you do get a combi boiler get a sutible size, my shower goes cold as soon as the kitchen hot tap is turned on

 

[kme]

If you change / add a boiler....

Why on earth would you fit a `leccy shower???? Hot water is MUCH cheaper to produce by gas...........................

And, as for pressure issues - unvented

 

[OnOff]

Salamander DO do a pump (a few actually) to go with a combi boiler BUT pretty sure you still need a cold water storage tank to supply the cold to the pump. Again Salamander, do "whole house pumps" that will boost the pressure on EVERYTHING, baths, toilets etc etc. If you do that though (add a boost pump) with a conventional hot cylinder and cold water storage tank then the capacities need to be big enough so has you're not emptying tanks quicker than they're filling up! Pumps don't like water starvation! Yes you can get switches to prevent this but it's hassle.

Not had much experience on the combi boiler front but the buy to let I've just purchased has had one fitted. LOADS more room in the loft as the cold water storage and header tanks are no longer required. Big bonus is that they have left all the old copper pipe in the loft too! I've heard they're expensive to repair when they go t!ts up though. At least my oil burner at home is pretty simple to work on.

 

[steptoe]

If you change / add a boiler....Why on earth would you fit a `leccy shower???? Hot water is MUCH cheaper to produce by gas...........................

And, as for pressure issues - unvented

mmmmm

I wouldnt have anything but a leccy shower,

I still think its more efficient,

and, maybe Im pessimistic, but, if you lose your boiler then you still have hot water.

 

[Doc Hudson]

mmmmmI wouldnt have anything but a leccy shower,

I still think its more efficient,

and, maybe Im pessimistic, but, if you lose your boiler then you still have hot water.

Having all the hot water in a property reliant on a single "modern" boiler is guaranteed to give you grief at some stage. From experience of friends and contacts that I know, most modern boilers, (combi or anyone with an electronic controlled pilot light) pack in at least once every three years. As steptoe says it can be advantageous to have a secondary source of hot water to wash with. Electric showers when used by most adults (who can wash in a reasonable duration) do not cost too much. Teenagers in the shower for 20+minutes at a time is a different issue!

Doc H.

 

[kme]

Oh, agreed.

Which is why I have two x 3KW immersions in the cylinder, too!!!!

Why two? cos they provide two sockets for `em, and it`ll save having to fart around with replacing a duff one if the boiler goes t1t5 up

 

[PC Electrics]

Personally I am not a fan of combi boilers. My impression (I haven't done any scientific research on the matter) is that they are les reliable than system boilers. So, I agree with Manator, if all your hot water and heating needs are supplied by just one device, you are in for trouble at some time or other.

I would always have a well insulated DHW, preferably a pressurised one. That way you've got an immersion for hot water back up in the event of boiler breakdown. It also opens the door to solar hot water generation or using some of your generated PV electric to heat the water in the day. Choose a cylinder with a low side mount immersion.

My house has a standard DHW, but to improve the pressure the storage tanks are raised up about 5 feet in the loft. The shower is fine. And properly fed by an independant hot water pipe from the tank too, so there are no issues with someone opening another hot tap.

You could always get a power shower with the pump unit in the loft. Mounted properly it should be virtually silent, unlike those Salamader types, which vibrate through the floor summat chronic.