Hi, I have trawled through many of the topics on here and so far have found a lot of negativity towards domestic installer courses. I am at the point in my life where my current profession is no longer viable as a living and i want to move into electrical work as a career and earn a regular income. However, there is a lack of opportunites to work with qualified electricians and do an apprentiship, which i would prefer. I am 30 and no one wants to take anyone on and train them, the main exscuse i get is kids these days are lazy and unreliable. My only alternative seems to be these DIS courses or a 2365 course. Does anyone have an opinion on these or know of a way in which i could do an apprentiship.......
How To Become Qualified
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Doc Hudson
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Welcome to the forum, the perception about negativity toward what you call domestic installer courses, (I presume you mean 5 or 6 week short intensive academic & regulations courses), has more relation to the background and type of person undertaking the course. The short courses were originally intended to be for experienced electricians who needed to bring their qualifications up to date during the implantation of Part P building regulations, around 2004-5-6ish. However many colleges used it as a quick money making scheme and suggest that a complete novice can start the course then 5 weeks later start up their own business earing £40,000+ p.a as a fully competent electrician. Which is a fairy tale and the only winners are the colleges who have your money. The short domestic courses typically give very little hands on practical work and experience, which is why many employers do not rate them very highly if they are looking for someone who can go out and resolve problems working on their own.
To answer your question better I think a bit more info about your electrical background and experience would help in guiding you in the right direction. Are you looking to be employed or starting your own business. What existing contacts do you have in the electrical trade. As almost all of the time it is who you know more than what you know. You say that you existing job is no longer viable, what research have you done to confirm that your choice of electrical work is viable so you are not wasting you investment of time and money? If you are looking for employment the best thing is to find out what qualifications employers are actually looking for.
Doc H.
To answer your question better I think a bit more info about your electrical background and experience would help in guiding you in the right direction. Are you looking to be employed or starting your own business. What existing contacts do you have in the electrical trade. As almost all of the time it is who you know more than what you know. You say that you existing job is no longer viable, what research have you done to confirm that your choice of electrical work is viable so you are not wasting you investment of time and money? If you are looking for employment the best thing is to find out what qualifications employers are actually looking for.
Doc H.
The Doc has said it all really , Rob. Yes within the trade , 5 week courses are looked down upon .
Step back and think about it for a moment :-
A bloke takes a 5 week college course and comes out as a qualified car mechanic , Plumber, heating engineer, builder, hydraulics engineer, electronics enngineer, doctor, nurse..........................I don't think so ..........so how does it work for electricians ? It doesn't. I presume it gives you a sketchy idea of the theory side of domestic wiring ...akin to the same level as an able and competent DIYer .
Modern apprenticeships were , I think, 4 years practical & theory . For the chronologically & flatulencly challenged sparks such as myself it was 6 years ( school leaving age 15) so how can it be reduced to 5 weeks ?
Thats why the trade looks down on the college short course schemes, but I do appreciate your position and wish you the best of luck .
All I can suggest is the college course but working with an electrician or small firm .
Step back and think about it for a moment :-
A bloke takes a 5 week college course and comes out as a qualified car mechanic , Plumber, heating engineer, builder, hydraulics engineer, electronics enngineer, doctor, nurse..........................I don't think so ..........so how does it work for electricians ? It doesn't. I presume it gives you a sketchy idea of the theory side of domestic wiring ...akin to the same level as an able and competent DIYer .
Modern apprenticeships were , I think, 4 years practical & theory . For the chronologically & flatulencly challenged sparks such as myself it was 6 years ( school leaving age 15) so how can it be reduced to 5 weeks ?
Thats why the trade looks down on the college short course schemes, but I do appreciate your position and wish you the best of luck .
All I can suggest is the college course but working with an electrician or small firm .
Try the C&G 2365 bud, it takes longer but you learn a hell of a lot more, much better than a 5 week course.
Andy Guinness
Andy Guinness
Hi, thanks for the reply, and I fully agree with you and the fact that no one can become qualified in 5 weeks, it is stupid and unrealistic . A bit of background from me is I studied at Uni in a degree that I deem useless to me and several years later I travelled and ended up becoming a snowsports instructor traveling the world, unfortunately I want to settle down and have a steady career and doing this is not viable. During my travels I have worked with builders labouring and stuff but I most enjoyed my time with the sparky, sadly only 2 months but it gave me an insight into a career that I would enjoy. Apart from that I have no other electrical experience and so far my research has shown little opportunities despite always reading there is a shortage of qualified trades people. I have no real interest in a short course as my Dad spent his time doing an apprenteship and says that is the only and best way forward, I just seem to be at a dead end when it comes to opportunities to do one.
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Who are the people saying there is a shortage of qualified trades people?????
Short course providers by any chance?
Punting for more customers???
What academic subjects do you have a reasonable grasp of...
e.g. a decent grasp of physics and maths will be a distinct advantage to getting your head around electrical design calculations & the logic of understanding your test meter readings etc..
Whereas if you are more geography & history & media studies sort of background....
then its going to be a bit more of a heavy slog to actually understand why you do something
-vs-
how you something when installing a circuit!
You mention Domestic installer course in your first post...
Stop and consider how stagnant the domestic housing market has been for several years..
1st time buyers & new builds etc... are some typical generators of domestic electrical work..
e.g.
rewires moves & changes etc...
Unless you are aiming for the council/housing association/rental sectors...
which can be driven more by lower quality quick response in/out fast turnaround tasks..
You need to work quick to turn the jobs around to make your targets for any decent money...
Why could you only do 2 months with the sparky?
can't that company offer you any work / apprenticeships?
Or don't they have enough work to take someone on?
Or are they not local enough??
Have you tried the jobs search engines to actually look at what work is advertised around your area?
I wish you well with your search and your studies....
But do take with a pinch of salt a lot of the claims about abundance of job opportunities and easy training....
Treat them like second hand car salesmen!!!!!
Guinness
the skills shortage reporting on the news always bugs me because they never say which skills they are short of!! More like short of muppets to work for £5/hr.
It's difficult to employ an older trainee, we have to pay you reasonable money for little skills, so realistically your best route is probably via labouring whilst studying (possibly via an agency). Hopefully you may get a chance to make contacts whilst on building sites - all employers are looking for keen workers. The 5WW courses will teach you basic electrical theory, which you can enhance by reading the Q&A section on this forum and back-checking the regs books, but only hands on work will teach you the finer points, like fixing back boxes to lathe and plaster walls, making trunking look neat and tidy, etc etc.
if you are registered unemployed you may be able to offer a company the chance to grab a grant for taking you on. Think you may be too old for that?
Can you live on crappy money for a few years whilst retraining? Would be more inclined to go into plumbing for better money.
It's difficult to employ an older trainee, we have to pay you reasonable money for little skills, so realistically your best route is probably via labouring whilst studying (possibly via an agency). Hopefully you may get a chance to make contacts whilst on building sites - all employers are looking for keen workers. The 5WW courses will teach you basic electrical theory, which you can enhance by reading the Q&A section on this forum and back-checking the regs books, but only hands on work will teach you the finer points, like fixing back boxes to lathe and plaster walls, making trunking look neat and tidy, etc etc.
if you are registered unemployed you may be able to offer a company the chance to grab a grant for taking you on. Think you may be too old for that?
Can you live on crappy money for a few years whilst retraining? Would be more inclined to go into plumbing for better money.
If I had my chance all over again I would certainly go for being a Plumber, they make more profit on supplying the boiler than we make on all the materials for a domestic install. How many poor plumbers (good ones) do you see.
Hi, I have a good grasp of physics and maths as my degree required some of that, in regards to shortages it always seems to be the media portraying this, but without much evidence to back it up. My time with the sparky was in Australia and my visa expired so i couldn't carry on and he couldn't get me sponsorship. your advice of second hand car salesmen is pretty spot on as the one i have spoken too are very cash hungry.
I'm pretty happy to live on crappy money for a few years as i have been for the past 4 so 4 more won't hurt whilst training and my nephew is a plumber so no real need in the family for another if you see what i mean,
Thanks for the advice so far though, is pretty valuable to be able to speak to people in the industry and get their viewpoint.
I'm pretty happy to live on crappy money for a few years as i have been for the past 4 so 4 more won't hurt whilst training and my nephew is a plumber so no real need in the family for another if you see what i mean,
Thanks for the advice so far though, is pretty valuable to be able to speak to people in the industry and get their viewpoint.
