Hyco 2Kw Fan Heater With 2X0.75Mm Flex!

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brummydave

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Just purchased this heater (called the Fiji model) from Denmans as our heating's not coping with the frost. It is a budget model to say the least but even so I noticed that the cable seemed a bit thin. That's because this class 2 appliance is supplied by a 2x0.75mm flex.

Correct me if i'm wrong, but this seems undersized for a 2kW appliance? Table 4F3A rates the cable at only 6A and there's over 4A per kW depending on voltage used...

I rang Hyco's sales office to speak to tech; the sales girl said she'd never been asked about cable sizes before and the tech guys are going to call me back. Hmmm!

In this case does manufacturer's instructions know something we don't?

Needless to say I won't be running it past 1kW...

Stay warm

 
It was the only fan heater they had in stock, maybe I know why now.

On the plus side my ten year old fan heater has a new lease of life once I opened it,found and then replaced a blackened and charred cable running from the stat to the power switch.

Bonus!

 
Whoop. Not sure why this got locked but as it's unlocked here's an update from Hyco...

"A 2kW appliance with a flex of less than 2m can be supplied with 0.75mm flex."

I had a nice chat with their tech man Ernie who said they've sold thousands of these and nobody's picked up on this before. Strange eh? He can't quite understand it but after he and the team went looking through their supplier's information they found this pearl of wisdom. So that's a turnup for the books, calc tables et al isn't it?!

Anybody heard of this sort of thing before? Apparently the flex on tumble driers is getting thinner too.....

 
Canoeboy said:
Can they tell you where this pearl of wisdom comes from then ? Is it in a British Standard ?
Click to expand...
Please brummydave, see if you can get them to tell you which standard this comes from, and actually, if you can, get them to tell you what BS's the heater is designed and manufactured to meet?

 
Trading standards might take an interest, but, then again, perhaps not...... All they are interested in nowadays is people with copied CD's at car boot sales. Point them at a medium sized firm that they [trading standards] think has the financial muscle to bite back, and they will just walk away.........

john...

 
Thanks for all your interest chaps!

I've spoken to the tech guy again and he said it was an engineer who showed him something in writing to this effect. He's not able to get back to me until monday with more detail.

When I pressed him saying I needed something in writing from the manufacturer to be able to fit these appliances as they go against advice in bs7671 he fully sympathised and said he would have helpful information on monday.

From the manual in the box...

There's no mention of any standards that it is made to. Under 'Electrical Connection' it does say "This heater is intended solely as a portable appliance; only operate using the power cord and 13amp plug supplied." 

Under Specification, supply is 230V 50Hz, the cable length is 135cm and the power is 1000W / 2000W.

The unit label has a CE mark but no other standards.

I'll keep you all posted!

 
Now to bear the CE mark, it MUST have a Declaration of Conformity (or whatever they call it these days).

On this "certificate" it MUST bear the numbers of all of the standards that it meets in order to claim CE marking against the relevant "New Approach Directive" in this case it would be the Low Voltage Directive & the EMC Directive.

Thus, the manufacturer has a statute law duty to provide this information as part of the equipment instructions, no matter how much the appliance costs.

This is non-negotiable, and is a legal requirement.

End of.

It will be interesting to see what they say bd.

We can keep giving you the ammo, if you are prepared to fire it mate.

SERIOUSLY things like this need to be gotten to the bottom of.

IF they can prove it complies then fine.

One thing though, BS7671 does not apply.

At the moment the favourite is BS EN IEC 60335-1, this is under investigation, and I am not 100% on the std. no. at the moment.

Please help us to follow this up bd if you would?

Thanks

 
Andy™ said:
what about cable temp - do you have anything to measure what temp it gets to in normal use?
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I've got an Ikea food thermometer :) . Not as accurate as some devices, but has told me the air coming out is over 80 degrees on 2kW, and the cable outer is about 28 degrees. On 1kW it was reading 23 degrees. Our air temperature is 17-19 degrees depending on the drafts.

The live pin on the plug however, that's a different story! It felt very hot although the thermometer was reading 38 degrees at most. (I realise for this application it's not ideal - for my meat it's great however!)

I'm glad to say at least inside the plug all was well, wired correctly and tightly - although that skinny flex does worry me.

I also used an energy meter to show it is pulling a genuine 2kW.

As I said, will wait til monday for more info. It's a matter of interest and safety - if they've really sold thousands of these then god help the users! I think my heater is definitely going back to Denmans/The skip next week, unless I keep it for some sort of proof..

Sidewinder said:
Now to bear the CE mark, it MUST have a Declaration of Conformity (or whatever they call it these days).

On this "certificate" it MUST bear the numbers of all of the standards that it meets in order to claim CE marking against the relevant "New Approach Directive" in this case it would be the Low Voltage Directive & the EMC Directive.

Thus, the manufacturer has a statute law duty to provide this information as part of the equipment instructions, no matter how much the appliance costs.

This is non-negotiable, and is a legal requirement.

End of.

It will be interesting to see what they say bd.

We can keep giving you the ammo, if you are prepared to fire it mate.

SERIOUSLY things like this need to be gotten to the bottom of.

IF they can prove it complies then fine.

One thing though, BS7671 does not apply.

At the moment the favourite is BS EN IEC 60335-1, this is under investigation, and I am not 100% on the std. no. at the moment.

Please help us to follow this up bd if you would?

Thanks
Click to expand...
Who would I fire at?

I think i've seen this kind of paperwork before, but there was nothing in the box about conformity. The only thing close is a paragraph about correct disposal in accordance with european directive 2002/96/E.

On their website they only list a similar model the FH-201 rather than FH-201Z. http://www.hyco.co.uk/product.asp?id=201 You can see a similar instruction manual to mine on there.

Time to put a jumper on ;) .

I'll keep you posted!

 
OK, done some digging.

2kW rated single phase (230V a.c.) portable appliance.

2000/230 = 8.69A (By Ohms law, heating element is pretty resistive), yes unit may have a fan motor, which will have a cap, but power factor will be pretty close to unity.

So allowing perhaps 9A for the element and fan motor (humour me).

Table 11 in BS EN 60335-1:2012 + A1:2014, Household and similar appliances - safety - Part 1: General Requirements.

Appliances with a rated current >6A but <=10A 1.0 mm sq, (0.75mm sq.). Values in brackets are allowed for cords <2m in length.

So, it seems that the supplier/manufacturer is correct.

This does however, hinge on the cable being fitted with a specific plug from IEC/TR 60083, which I know nothing about.

This, may, or may not include a BS1363 plug, though TBH, I suspect it does.

 
I've looked up the current rating of several brands of 0.75mm flex, and not found one that rates their cable at more than 6A.

So now we have a BS spec, saying you can put 10A through a cable rated by it's manufacturer at 6A as long as it's no more than 2 metres long.

A case of let's ignore manufacturers instructions when it suits us.

Can I quote this in court as a reason why I can ignore manufacturers instructions then? (not that I ignore them or am expecting to go to court)

 

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