Moat pronounced dead at 2.20 am!

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Strange how the media reports things like this , it seemed to be treated as an ongoing drama .

Last week ,in Birmingham, there were at least 5 shootings , non reported ,as far as I know , in the national news media. A lot are not followed by the local media,either.

 
i know some one who moved to australia, i told them this morning and they already knew as it had been on news there, i have herd nothing of shootings in birmingham

 
so your not a danger now but whos to say that you wont be some time down the line, if you have a gun there always a chance you may use it. not directed at you patch the likely hood is you never will but can it be said for all gun owners.
Or my chainsaw, or my sledgehammer, or my kitchen knives, or a baseball bat [don't actually own one of them]..........

Simple fact is - all of us are most likely to kill someone [or be killed ourselves] by a vehicle. Look how many irresponsible 17 year old we give a licence to who then go and kill someone. I know people who died on the road personally, I don't know anyone who's been shot.

 
Or my chainsaw, or my sledgehammer, or my kitchen knives, or a baseball bat [don't actually own one of them]..........Simple fact is - all of us are most likely to kill someone [or be killed ourselves] by a vehicle. Look how many irresponsible 17 year old we give a licence to who then go and kill someone. I know people who died on the road personally, I don't know anyone who's been shot.
more motorist than gun owners though, and yes you could prity much use anything to kill if you wanted to, but i bet i could out run someone with a chainsaw.

 
more motorist than gun owners though, and yes you could prity much use anything to kill if you wanted to, but i bet i could out run someone with a chainsaw.
630,000 shotgun cert holders in Britain, I am sure that if you looked pro-rata the rate of deaths from cars would remain much higher. Almost all firearm incidents involve illegally held weapons (this case in point).

You can never say that a person won't go on a rampage, but it happens very infrequently and the system is very thorough (need references, let them see your medical records, criminal record and identity checks).

You couldn't outrun me in my car...........

:D

:good night:

 
630,000 shotgun cert holders in Britain, I am sure that if you looked pro-rata the rate of deaths from cars would remain much higher. Almost all firearm incidents involve illegally held weapons (this case in point). thats a lot of gun owners but remember cars are used more frequentlyYou can never say that a person won't go on a rampage, but it happens very infrequently and the system is very thorough (need references, let them see your medical records, criminal record and identity checks).

thats my point, you could be sound mind today angry and confused tommorrow

You couldn't outrun me in my car...........

i dont know i am prity quick, is it a ferrari?, still got a better chance than out running buckshot ;)

:D

:good night:
i am not all anti gun thats not my point just simply that any one can snap and if you have a gun its a very easy to go round causing instant death, you could do the same in a car but people would prob see you coming and its unlikley that something that is a necesity to everyday life will be baned, guns however are not a necesity to everyday life. i am under no illusions that if all guns were baned that gun crime would go down much.

dont you have bolt guns for destroying live stock, or inject them, i did not think they used guns any more?

 
i know some one who moved to australia, i told them this morning and they already knew as it had been on news there, i have herd nothing of shootings in birmingham
Three people outside a club , one person about a mile from us, I think was fatal, the other one , police had a road sealed , stopped traffic from entering

armed police standing around ,someone said it was a shooting.

Have read nothing about it whatsoever.

 
so your not a danger now but whos to say that you wont be some time down the line, if you have a gun there always a chance you may use it. not directed at you patch the likely hood is you never will but can it be said for all gun owners.
i have loads of tools etc in my van that could quite easily kill. doesnt mean im going to use them for that purpose

 
dont you have bolt guns for destroying live stock, or inject them, i did not think they used guns any more?
A captive bolt just stuns them, but can be used yes. We inject most of the time but if a fully grown animal breaks its leg then we can shoot it and it can enter the food chain.

 
Its my 'Rapier wit' that kills

some people just die laughing

ok im gone

:coat

 
Interestingly I do not have a shotgun anymore, but thats because I have not had the time to go shooting, my son has sold his as well so we are now gun less so to speak.

I was brought up with firearms and I have fired almost every known weapon, including the machine pistols type, I had a browning automatic shotgun, 3 mag = normal shotgun licence 5 mag= class 1 firearms, both can kill and fire as fast as you can pull the trigger.

Only thing is the police know where all licenced guns are at any one time and besides the regular inspections they can do spot checks when they want to as well.

Criminals will not register a firearm because they would not be able to have one, so any restrictions on gun laws is futile as it only effects those who are registered.

 
My take on this if you have a gun there is a good chance you may end up dead simple really. Nobody needs a gun apart from maybe farmers etc.
Interesting that the word "need" is used here, it often is when people have different prejudices to our own I find!

I don't need my guns, any more than I need a car capable of exceeding the speed limit, but my word I'd go a long way to fight for my right to have both!

 
I dont think there is ANY need for ANYONE other than the police/SAS etc etc to have guns.

There just isnt any justification for it.

 
Maybe we should start a list of other things there is no justification for (to keep it simple we list only those that have killed more UK citizens than legally held fire arms in the past 12 months). I'll start:

Alcohol

 
As bizarre and contentious as this may seem, I actually feel very sorry for Moat. I worked as a professional full time doorman for many many years in some of the roughest cities / towns in our land. I have been witness to many horrors and had hands in things that only appear in films and your worst nightmares. Sadly, Moat's life was one that many professional bouncers find themselves in, me included in my dark distant past which was the stereotypical life of violence, steroids, organised crime etc. The lifestyle eventually takes a strangle hold over you and it becomes a debauched way of existing. You train to increase size, take 'gear' to increase size, which in turn does have psychological effects. You grow big, spend your life inflicting pain (both on and off the doors) and in a sick way you enjoy it - it becomes your lifeblood that you need to survive. Aggression and anger are at the forefront of your psyche and character and it doesn't take much to send you over the 'edge'. I was lucky and had a return ticket!My belief is that Moat was a good man, dillusional, angry, violent and DESPERATE. That alone is enough to try the best of us. However, in a man who treads a fine line between good and bad daily it soon becomes a reality. Now hear me before you all throw stones in my direction - I do not condone in any way shape or form what this man did. I simply understand and have empathy for a man caught in a bad situation which to be fair - most will never venture into or begin to understand. He crossed the line for sure but he wasn't mad - just had ALL the wrong buttons pushed in / out of prison.

If you don't get my meaning - watch the film 'Falling Down' with Michael Douglas - it will put everything I have written into perspective. We are all capable of the most despicable and heinous of acts - it is just that most have the ability to rationalise. Maybe he didn't or lost it somewhere along the way.

My thoughts and prayers are with everyone touched by this tragedy.
excellent post i totally agree.

 
I dont think there is ANY need for ANYONE other than the police/SAS etc etc to have guns.There just isnt any justification for it.
you may stab someone with your kitchen knife. cant see any need for you to have one, so you should get rid of it.

you may also run someone over in your car/van. cant see any reason you need one of these either, so you should get rid of it.

 
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