Old Style Fuse Boards With Asbestos Flash Pads

[switch10]

I have recently been asked to change some fuseboards in a commercial premises, now whilst taking a quick look it appears these fuseboards have asbestos flash pads behind the fuses. Now they have several issues and would like some works done on these boards temporary whilst waiting for authorisation for boards to be changed . I need to remove several fuses . How do I stand on this and would you do it? Does liability insurance cover this as can't see anywhere in any policies that state will cover this if asbestos breaks when fuse is removed or put back.

If you would carry on with this does your insurance cover this and if so who are you with?

 

[Essex1]

The asbestos generally used on distribution boards is not the type you need a licence to remove. You do however need to be competent. You can attend a 1 day course to be shown how to remove non-licensed asbestos safely.

When I come across these we tend to removed the DB completely without touching or disturbing the asbestos. Then double bag it and hand it over to a specialist waste carrier. I do these without even opening the DB up as over the years asbestos dust could build up in the bottom of the DB.

Although it is asbestos it is extremely low risk but that does not mean you should take any risks however. I think it would be a judgement call for the person on site to decide whether it is safe to remove the fuses or not. Are you 'asbestos awareness' trained? If not then you may not be competent to make the call. If there is any signs of damage then I would say no.

 

[Manator]

Asbestos in these boards only become a danger if disturbed. I have changed a few in my time and the procedure is described somewhere however I cannot remember where.

What I did was to cut all cables where they entered the boards, then I sprayed the inside of the boards with water leaving all the mcb's in place. I removed them from the wall wearing gloves mask and a protective all in one suit, then I placed the whole unit in a plastic bag which in turn was placed into another bag. Disposal was via the local council and marked as asbestos waste.

 

[Essex1]

Asbestos in these boards only become a danger if disturbed. I have changed a few in my time and the procedure is described somewhere however I cannot remember where.

What I did was to cut all cables where they entered the boards, then I sprayed the inside of the boards with water leaving all the mcb's in place. I removed them from the wall wearing gloves mask and a protective all in one suit, then I placed the whole unit in a plastic bag which in turn was placed into another bag. Disposal was via the local council and marked as asbestos waste.

Still probably better to get properly trained however. As the op would need to know what to do if the asbestos became damaged during the work and fibres were potentially released into the air.

 

[Manator]

Still probably better to get properly trained however. As the op would need to know what to do if the asbestos became damaged during the work and fibres were potentially released into the air.

I agree, I always thought all electricians had to have asbestos awareness. I know I need to redo mine shortly.

 

[switch10]

Essex . I have undergone basic asbestos awareness training .

Manator. Yes I was looking at cutting cables before entry to fuseboard and then unscrewing however if there's dust this could still release dust into air. Only other thing I thought of was to use a crow bar to get it off the wall into correct bags. Customer would ideally like fuse pulled and damaged cable fixed and fuse put back but have asked for proof that insirance will cover this and no where in insurance can I see anything about it

 

[Essex1]

I agree, I always thought all electricians had to have asbestos awareness. I know I need to redo mine shortly.

  

Essex . I have undergone basic asbestos awareness training .

Manator. Yes I was looking at cutting cables before entry to fuseboard and then unscrewing however if there's dust this could still release dust into air. Only other thing I thought of was to use a crow bar to get it off the wall into correct bags. Customer would ideally like fuse pulled and damaged cable fixed and fuse put back but have asked for proof that insirance will cover this and no where in insurance can I see anything about it

So in order to remove the asbestos you would need to do the next stage up from Asbestos awareness which is removal of unlicensed asbestos which this is.

 

[Manator]

Switch, everything is possible providing the risk assessment and method statements allow it. It is possible to do remedial work on these boards providing extra care is taken and the risks are identified. We were told not to rip the boards from the wall as this potentially caused more damage and increased the risk of dust being sent into the air.

Essex1 you do not need to have anything to remove non licensed asbestos, providing certain precautions are undertaken and criteria met.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/licensing/non-licensed-work.htm

 

[switch10]

Thanks Essex from what I've read online it wouldn't pay for me to do the course as is a large course for how much I could charge for the work.

Manator

I have put together a risk and method statement which has been accepted by the company however the last thing was insurance which mine doesn't show and have spoken to a few companies who say would need asbestos removal course but to do this is over 5k as no short course for this sort of work and would need complete course which then makes you able to do licensed work

 

[Essex1]

Switch, everything is possible providing the risk assessment and method statements allow it. It is possible to do remedial work on these boards providing extra care is taken and the risks are identified. We were told not to rip the boards from the wall as this potentially caused more damage and increased the risk of dust being sent into the air.

Essex1 you do not need to have anything to remove non licensed asbestos, providing certain precautions are undertaken and criteria met.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/licensing/non-licensed-work.htm

I have to disagree. "The Control of Asbestos Regulations 2012 prevents anyone from removing Asbestos Containing Materials (ACM’s) unless they have received the correct training."

Now the training for unlicensed asbestos can be done for under £200 and takes one day. Surely not beyond the purse strings for this kind of job and you cannot put a price on doing a job safely.

 

[Andy™]

you would be best working with a licenced asbestos contractor who can do all the removal work with you isolating supplies and disconnecting cables where necessary

 

[Essex1]

Switch, everything is possible providing the risk assessment and method statements allow it. It is possible to do remedial work on these boards providing extra care is taken and the risks are identified. We were told not to rip the boards from the wall as this potentially caused more damage and increased the risk of dust being sent into the air.

Essex1 you do not need to have anything to remove non licensed asbestos, providing certain precautions are undertaken and criteria met.

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/licensing/non-licensed-work.htm

Copy and pasted from your link - All non-licensed and notifiable non-licensed work with asbestos needs a risk assessment and must be carried out with the appropriate controls in place, and those carrying out the work must have had the correct level of information, instruction and training, to protect themselves (and others in the area) from the risks to health that exposure to asbestos causes.

 

[switch10]

I have to disagree. "The Control of Asbestos Regulations 2012 prevents anyone from removing Asbestos Containing Materials (ACM’s) unless they have received the correct training."

Now the training for unlicensed asbestos can be done for under £200 and takes one day. Surely not beyond the purse strings for this kind of job and you cannot put a price on doing a job safely.

Can you provide a link to where I can do this for that fee? As local to me is 5k

you would be best working with a licenced asbestos contractor who can do all the removal work with you isolating supplies and disconnecting cables where necessary

I have done this with a company called abastra in the past and all they do is get me to isolate supply and cut cables and pry of wall with a long bar . 30 mins work and £380 fee

 

[Essex1]

Can you provide a link to where I can do this for that fee? As local to me is 5k

Bristol - £175http://thetrainingsocieti.co.uk/course/ukata-asbestos-non-licensed-removalwork/

Thanks Essex from what I've read online it wouldn't pay for me to do the course as is a large course for how much I could charge for the work.

Manator

I have put together a risk and method statement which has been accepted by the company however the last thing was insurance which mine doesn't show and have spoken to a few companies who say would need asbestos removal course but to do this is over 5k as no short course for this sort of work and would need complete course which then makes you able to do licensed work

I cannot see how anyone can put together a risk assessment in the safe removal of unlicensed asbestos if they have not been trained in how to remove it safely. What were the control measures you put in in you RA? Even more silly is the company has 'signed it off'.

 

[switch10]

The risk assessment was put together using the guidelines set out by HSE and HSE guidelines for removing fuses with asbestos in and company have contacted them and they have said as long as guidelines followed then removal course not required. But I have nothing in writing so trying to cover myself

 

[Essex1]

The risk assessment was put together using the guidelines set out by HSE and HSE guidelines for removing fuses with asbestos in and company have contacted them and they have said as long as guidelines followed then removal course not required. But I have nothing in writing so trying to cover myself

But the HSE guidelines say you need training?

 

[switch10]

when my customer spoke to them they said suitably trained in this small amount and type of asbestos is being able to indentify type of asbestos and what needs to be done such as shadow vacuuming /sheet of area and correct ppe to be worn. No mention of removal course . Which is why I'm confused and came on here to ask. Think I need to contact them myself .

 

[Apache]

The risk assessment was put together using the guidelines set out by HSE and HSE guidelines for removing fuses with asbestos in and company have contacted them and they have said as long as guidelines followed then removal course not required. But I have nothing in writing so trying to cover myself

The solution is to email HSE yourself - then you have it in writing.

I think Essex is speaking a lot of sense in this thread.

 

[switch10]

yes I think that's the best idea I will drop them a email now and let you know the outcome

 

[Essex1]

Cool. Good luck.