Problem with bathroom ceiling lighting

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Yes - it's a pull cord switch.There is a fan (with switch to have it turn on automatically with light, or not).

There is also a shaver socket (I'm not sure if this is important or not).

There is no switch outside the bathroom.

So - as I know very little about these things, I assume you would recommend that I call out a professional to look at it?

Would this be costly do you think?

Thanks.

Great photo's & good info..

Just to add my four-penny-worth to the other guys input...

a) In general most modern light fittings have naff all space to conceal any significant amount of wire. and the connection terminal strips are only just big enough to fit one wire in each connection 'L', 'N' & 'E' !

B) is there access above the ceiling?

personally if it was me i would try to move all of these wires out of the way and just have one twin & earth cable coming through the ceiling.

which will make it easier to fit your new light & replace that at a later date when you buy your next light!

and reduce risk of heat from the light affecting the cables.

Assuming access above ceiling (e.g. loft void) it would be very easy to install a suitable junction box to tidy all of these wires into!

Or alternatively you could have a circular dry line box cut into the ceiling behind the light with suitable connections made inside.

c) Assuming a worst case scenario where need to meter all of the wires out verifying polarity & connections & boxing away from the light fitting.. It shouldn't be more that a couple of hours Max... more realistically 1 to 1.5 hrs

d) One other thought.....

You say there is a fan with another switch to turn it off/on (when light comes on). Is there a separate fuse unit as well.

Many extractor fan manufactures instructions recommend a 3amp fuse it put in the fan supply? possibly may be worth considering whilst tiding these other wires up.

Oh by the way..

Welcome to the forum

 

[betty swollocks]

good photo's

from my point of view it would appear you have (left to right)

brown-live feed to light

blue-neutral feed to light

brown(green tape)-live to pull switch

blue(brown sleeved)-switched live from pull switch

black(brown sleeved)- switched live to fan(activates fan on light switching on)

brown-permanant live to fan(keeps fan running on when light switched off)

grey-neutral

brown-live feed to next light

blue- neutral feed to next light

testing is a must to ensure all the above are as they seem but in principle i would

connect all four browns together,

connect the two blues and grey together in the neutral terminal of new light

the blue and black wires with brown sleeving would go to the live terminal of the new light

ensure the green sleeved earths are all connected together in the earth terminal of the new light

with a meter any electrician would find this a very simple job, i appreciate OP hasnt either and so would recommend an electrician to do the install

1hr max imho, which includes drinking tea and (maybe a choccy biscuit, caramel's my fav at mo)and general footy/politics/wimmin chat whilst money is handed over

kind of job i would do on my way home or maybe send apprentice

 

[Barx]

Well, I ain't been shot yet.

Glad others agree with which cable is which. And in the 3 core debate. Black switch live and grey neutral. Some are tempted to use black as neutral as thats how it was in red/black days but just confuses things more in my opinion.

Let use know how you get on with it claude.

cheers mate.

 

[seajayess]

We use black as neutral with blue sleeve and grey as switch wire with brown sleeve as long as they are marked ! lets face it if you are not sure consult a qualified electrician, unless you can use a continuity meter to verify where the cables go those wires could do anything, ie the permanent lives could be the switch wires visa versa the only one that stands out is the three core which i think most would agree is the extract fan

 

[steptoe]

Although I haven`t got it by my side, and TBH if I had I probably couldn`t focus on it; I believe that there is something in either 7671 or OSG; which refers to which core to use. Though I must admit to preferring a black sleeved Blue, to a black sleeved g/y. Seems to make more sense, logically.Point is; AS LONG AS THEY`RE SLEEVED, it complies AFAIK.

Correct me if I`m wrong.....................????

sorry, but you are wrong

 

[steptoe]

We use black as neutral with blue sleeve and grey as switch wire with brown sleeve as long as they are marked ! lets face it if you are not sure consult a qualified electrician, unless you can use a continuity meter to verify where the cables go those wires could do anything, ie the permanent lives could be the switch wires visa versa the only one that stands out is the three core which i think most would agree is the extract fan

as above,#

that is a fail,

the only cable i would accapet from a competent person would be a blue slevved grey.

if a spark even thought about sleeving a black to blue for me i would **** him straight ooff my job.

how many yellows did you sleeve to black on the old colours,?

both posters please.

 

[seajayess]

as above,#that is a fail,

the only cable i would accapet from a competent person would be a blue slevved grey.

if a spark even thought about sleeving a black to blue for me i would **** him straight ooff my job.

how many yellows did you sleeve to black on the old colours,?

both posters please.

Please supply me with page number of regs book to confirm your statment then I will take note as long as they have identfication the orange wire from a motorised valve on a boiler system is a live so sleeved with brown the grey wire is a permanent live this to is sleeved with brown looking forward to getting a page number

 

[kme]

Steptoe.

None mate; `cos there was a perfectly good blue sitting there. There isn`t in the new colours, and, TBH, the way I would explain myself is this:

Black WAS neutral in old cable, but blue in flex. But blue was a phase in 3 phase, so maybe I should have sleeved the blue as black? We were never told to do that, and I never saw anyone putting black sleeving on an old blue.

New colour cable contains a black; which USED to be neutral in cable; single or 3 ph. If we`re on single phase, which would be apparent by the lack of other phases, sleeving it blue seems logical; and appears to be backed up your best friend, BS7671.

This train of thought that suggests that -sleeving the black as blue, and using as neutral, - would be confusing seems utterly nonsensical and illogiacal m8. Surely it`s more logical to have the colour which, until recently WAS neutral; irrespective of cable or flex, being used as neutral. I reiterate: IF its sleeved the correct colour; it complies, in my humble opinion.

Debate..............

 

[Theorysparky]

Steptoe. None mate; `cos there was a perfectly good blue sitting there. There isn`t in the new colours, and, TBH, the way I would explain myself is this:

Black WAS neutral in old cable, but blue in flex. But blue was a phase in 3 phase, so maybe I should have sleeved the blue as black? We were never told to do that, and I never saw anyone putting black sleeving on an old blue.

New colour cable contains a black; which USED to be neutral in cable; single or 3 ph. If we`re on single phase, which would be apparent by the lack of other phases, sleeving it blue seems logical; and appears to be backed up your best friend, BS7671.

This train of thought that suggests that -sleeving the black as blue, and using as neutral, - would be confusing seems utterly nonsensical and illogiacal m8. Surely it`s more logical to have the colour which, until recently WAS neutral; irrespective of cable or flex, being used as neutral. I reiterate: IF its sleeved the correct colour; it complies, in my humble opinion.

Debate..............

for what its worth i agree with that Kme

how many light switches have the blue neutral sleeved brown ????

which is acceptable,,ideally twin brown and earth should be used

2 way lighting ???? brown,black,grey sleeved brown

so domestically sleeving is not a major issue

on the other hand i have been on commercial site where the company running the sparks had its own ideas about the colours,,a few choice words there.

 

[seajayess]

Steptoe have got the 16 th. and the 17 th. 7671 out just need that page number

 

[M107]

Even better when you turn up on a job take a look to find the maint sparks haven't bothered to sleeve any of the conductors.

For me I sleeve

Grey with blue as neutral in swa or brown as a strapper in 3C&E

Black with green/yellow for swa or brown as a strapper in 3C&E

Brown well its fine as is

But lets not fall out over it people :x

 

[Theorysparky]

Even better when you turn up on a job take a look to find the maint sparks haven't bothered to sleeve any of the conductors.For me I sleeve

Grey with blue as neutral in swa or brown as a strapper in 3C&E

Black with green/yellow for swa or brown as a strapper in 3C&E

Brown well its fine as is

But lets not fall out over it people :x

why not grey with green/yellow ?????

and black with blue ???

thats the way i would do it

i thought that would be logical but there seems to be no clear guidance

but like i said if its sleeved whats the issue

maybe in the 18th when it comes out :^O :^O:^O

 

[kme]

I`m with theo here..........

Mind you, he SHOULD be in bed by now......

Theo. Get your Pyjamas (rather than your coat)

 

[steptoe]

right. Ive been away doing more important things past couple of days,

the reason i wont/cant give you a BS7671 page is cos it dont exist,

but as I said before reg16 EAWR does.

just because you did something in the past was OK dont make it safe now.

do you still use a black as a N in 3ph anymore just because you did a year ago?

thought not,

times change guys, get with the motion and lets all help the UK crawl out of the dark ages and get its electrical system up and running with the times.

there is a standard recognised system of sleeving 3ph colours to work in a single phase install, please lets all use them instead of or own little ideas.