Referendums ! Is there any point ?

[Evans Electric]

If  a referendum was held  to stop immigration dead!   the people would vote  yes .

Bring back capital punishment for terrorists & bombers say..............yes.

But like today  they wouldn't get through parliament  so is there any point  I ask ?   

 

[Murdoch]

That’s why traitor Blair wouldn’t allow the UK public a vote on the Lisbon Treaty .....

he knew we would reject it ......

 

[Sharpend]

Democracy is only a word that is used to make you believe you have a say, it doesn’t really exist. 

 

[Murdoch]

You have to look no further than Scotland to see how politicians change their spots 

The SNP used to say PR was the only answer

now first past the post rules ok

what changed ? The SNPs popularity!

 

[phil d]

An interesting thought to mull over, remember many many years ago, the old slogan when women worked but hadn't got the right to vote, "no taxation without representation". Well how does this sit with you guys. The politicians have shown their true colours over Brexit, they want to do what they want to do, regardless of what the people want, indeed our local MP has shot himself in the foot quite spectacularly in an attempt to increase his popularity, he publicly announced in the local media the other day that he'd voted in Parliament to BLOCK Brexit, even though most of his constituents voted to leave. His reasoning being that in his opinion we're better in the EU than out! Well that's him finished at the next local elections, It's a bit like one of use going to a customers house, the customer wants 4 single sockets in his kitchen, but we decide to fit 6 twins, now WE may think it is better, but it isn't what we were asked to do.

So if there is this thing that people should not be taxed, unless they are represented,( no doubt it will all be in the representation of the people act) then technically, and also legally, if it were to come out that MP's were actively blocking Brexit, and I believe some are, then we, the people who voted leave, are not being represented, and should therefore not be taxed!

I'm sure there are cleverer people than me out there who could work this all out, but wouldn't it be a ****** if it happened, imagine how screwed the system would be then, even better if we used the European courts to make it happen, a government made up of arrogant little pricks who think they can ride roughshod over the working man, the very same people who put them in power, suddenly found out they were all out of a job because there were no taxes being paid to pay their wages, oh can you imagine it, the mere thought makes me happy. 

 

[ProDave]

That’s why traitor Blair wouldn’t allow the UK public a vote on the Lisbon Treaty .....

he knew we would reject it ......

BUT I have always maintained IF we had rejected it, then it would have been re negotiated, toned down a bit and we might have been able to slow the march to a United States of Europe.  And if the people had been engaged with the process and accepted the revised proposal, we would probably not  be in the holy mess we are now.

I think it is largely because we were promised a referendum on Lisbon, and then denied it, that there is so much pent up anger about the European Project that led to the referendum result we had.

 

[binky]

most people don't even know what the Lisbon Treaty was / is. 

A lot of the voting was a protest vote, particularly aimed at immigration - leaving the EU seems to be the only way to stop it, especially when we keep getting told the UK can't run without them! 

We have a rediculous position where party politics seems more important than voting for an able MP, and as there are only really 2 parties, desperate to hang on to power, we are never going to get proper representation of the people. I like to think PR would allow better representation of all the people, even with extreme views, would engeneder greater cooperation across parties, and in theory should result in more sensible running of the country.  No I haven't been smoking funny things!  :^O

 

[Murdoch]

BUT I have always maintained IF we had rejected it, then it would have been re negotiated, toned down a bit and we might have been able to slow the march to a United States of Europe.  And if the people had been engaged with the process and accepted the revised proposal, we would probably not  be in the holy mess we are now.

I think it is largely because we were promised a referendum on Lisbon, and then denied it, that there is so much pent up anger about the European Project that led to the referendum result we had.

I agree 110%

Tony Blair is the cause of this mess

 

[Geoff1946]

I agree 110%

Tony Blair is the cause of this mess

Agreed, closely followed by Cameron who so casually called a referendum with no terms and no plan and then immediately cleared off when it all turned to Sh* on him! 

Basically politicians are useless.

 

[Murdoch]

Agreed, closely followed by Cameron who so casually called a referendum with no terms and no plan and then immediately cleared off when it all turned to Sh* on him! 

Basically politicians are useless.

Yup . But it will be Teresa May who will be remembered the most 

talk about being dealt a poor hand ......

personally I think the only option now is no deal and 2 fingers to the unelected gimps in a Brussels 

 

[phil d]

Yup . But it will be Teresa May who will be remembered the most 

talk about being dealt a poor hand ......

personally I think the only option now is no deal and 2 fingers to the unelected gimps in a Brussels 

The problem for me is that most people have the memory of a goldfish, they are all too quick to forget all the cock ups that politicians make, they only remember the good bits, if by some miracle they manage to deliver one good thing out of all of this mess, all the disasters will be forgotten. It's a bit like where I live, we've had a labour council for years, they've made loads of mess, yet come election time they trawl out one little 'gift' for the voters, and the idiots vote them in again.

We've had roads falling to bits, libraries closed, adult social care cut, youth clubs closed, parks left to go to rack and ruin, the council have wasted money on things such as trips to other places to 'investigate' ways to save money, or do things better, yet these trips don't involve sending one or two people, oh no they all go! There was one event, after another round of cuts, about a dozen of them jetted off abroad to see how another country handled recycling, there was uproar from the townspeople over this waste of money and quite rightly so. However, come election time they decide to spend a few quid tidying up a local grot spot, and hey ho, "look at how wonderful our local council are" people exclaimed, and once again they got voted in, a few weeks after the election they are at it again!

There's one of them who announced in the local press this week that he'd voted in Parliament to block Brexit, because he thought it was the best thing, this was despite the majority of his constituents voting to leave the EU!

If you look at a lot of people who've come out of government they seem to have found cushy high paid jobs in Brussels, maybe this is the reason they are fighting to stay in the EU, after all, I'm assuming that if we do leave, these people will not be able to leap on board another gravy train after they get thrown off the first one. 

 

[binky]

roads falling to bits etc etc is down to Osbournes austerity budget, which comes to full fruition next year when all local councils will receive absolutely 0, nil, zilch, firk all funding from central government. Like things were great before the bank crash! 

 

[phil d]

roads falling to bits etc etc is down to Osbournes austerity budget, which comes to full fruition next year when all local councils will receive absolutely 0, nil, zilch, firk all funding from central government. Like things were great before the bank crash! 

Yes but our council are ridiculous the way they waste cash, they have stupid 'budgets' for things that make no sense and even less of a priority. for example, a few years ago the roads on our estate were falling to pieces, so I rang the council, "I'm very sorry, there's no money in the budget for road repairs at the moment" I was told, several weeks later they turn up and start digging holes alongside the road, the next day they are planting trees, so I ring up again, "Yes, the trees will look lovely when they get established, we had money in our tree budget, but not in the one for road repairs". When I pointed out that in a few years these large trees would present an even bigger hazard to traffic than the bollards they'd removed a few months earlier, because, 'they present a hazard if a vehicle hits one', seemed lost on them, it was just a way of wasting money.

Put it this way, you have yourself, your wife and 2 children, you also have only £50 in the bank, no food in the cupboards and Sony have brought out a new PlayStation game, do you, A, spend the £50 on food for the family, or B, let the family go hungry and buy the video game? Common sense says option A, the problem is our council, and indeed most councils have very little common sense when it comes down to prioritising the use of limited funds.

 

[binky]

the tree budget was probably either EU money or direct from central government to show how much they care about climate change and couldn't be spent on anything else.

If you have ever been involved with a council contract, you would also understand a lot of the money that gets wasted is due to mitigating legal worries, such as  being sued by a member of the  general public because they didn't see the hole in the ground that was hiding behind the big orange barriers and fell into it whilst drunk..

 

[Sharpend]

roads falling to bits etc etc is down to Osbournes austerity budget, which comes to full fruition next year when all local councils will receive absolutely 0, nil, zilch, firk all funding from central government. Like things were great before the bank crash! 

The councils have more money than they let on, remember a feed years back when the Icelandic bank was in trouble, well it transpired that our local council had a £7.5m balance in it, but ask for any services like pot hole repairs, clearance if snowed over roads or even a few extra road closure signs then there was no money to be had. 

They must think I was born last night! 

 

[binky]

that's why they keep sacking staff then, oh silly me it's just a council conspiracy to plead poverty  :^O

They do keep a small reserve fund for emergencies . Suggest you have a look at your local councils accounts, then work out how much more is yet to be cut on top of all the previous years cuts....

 

[Evans Electric]

well it transpired that our local council had a £7.5m balance in it, but ask for any services like pot hole repairs, clearance if snowed over roads or even a few extra road closure signs then there was no money to be had. 

I think they all have this ,  going back to  1970's  I can remember someone  unearthing the fact that B,ham City Council was  raising the rates  but had £6,000,000  in the bank  .   The council comment was  they were not allowed to touch it but could draw on the interest  .  

I think I have that right . 

We all have a situation mow where central government is withholding funds to local councils and ordering them to make cut-backs .  Hence services shutting down . 

I'd say there was little money in the country and they live from month to month   hence hitting the self employed  for a second payment on account  ,  look at the funding for the Police  ...I think Brum now has one copper on a bike   with a Yorkshire Terrier in the basket.   

 

[Andy™]

I think they all have this ,  going back to  1970's  I can remember someone  unearthing the fact that B,ham City Council was  raising the rates  but had £6,000,000  in the bank  .   The council comment was  they were not allowed to touch it but could draw on the interest  .  

I think I have that right . 

We all have a situation mow where central government is withholding funds to local councils and ordering them to make cut-backs .  Hence services shutting down . 

I'd say there was little money in the country and they live from month to month   hence hitting the self employed  for a second payment on account  ,  look at the funding for the Police  ...I think Brum now has one copper on a bike   with a Yorkshire Terrier in the basket.   

tbh councils are right to keep hold of some cash for emergencies etc. never know whats going to happen. in the grand scheme of things, 6 million wouldnt last long if they started dipping into it now

 

[Sharpend]

I’m not aggrieved by the fact that they hold the contingency fund - we all attempt to do that- I think it’s the fact that the government implement austerity which cripples those that are in need and can always mysteriously find a couple of billion for a foreign disaster or the like. Perhaps that’s out of their contingency fund???? 

 

[Evans Electric]

Just thinking on the subject of referendums    ..(What would the plural of referendum be ?   ..Referendii ?  Referendems?)  .......  if they presented a referendum to the electrical trade  asking ..."    Now we have a set colour code for our wiring  do you think we should change it totally?"     " Yes or no?"

I think I can predict the answer.