Smoke/ Heat/ Co Alarms

[Revved Up Sparky]

A friend (who is a landlord) has asked me to install mains powered smoke/ heat/ co detectors in one of his properties, a first floor flat.

Admittedly I have'nt had time to do any research yet but I would like to pick some brains if that's OK.

3 Questions

1. In an L shaped kitchen/ living room, kitchen part about 10ftx10ft, living room part about 15ftx10ft, do I need to fit a smoke detector in the living room part ? my concern is that cooking will set it off - I am putting a heat detector in the kitchen part.

2. There is no oil or gas central heating boiler - but there is an open fire in the living room area, do I need to fit a CO detector ?

3. The main reason for my friend wanting this work done - the flat is non smoking and his tenant is smoking - he wants smoke detectors that will sound when a cigarette is lit. Are there smoke alarms that are this sensitive ? do you know what make / model ?

I will be putting smoke detectors in the bedrooms as the hall between the bedrooms is only a metre square and a loft hatch dominates the ceiling- no room.

Any input appreciated, thanks

 

[ProDave]

From 1st December it's the law here that rental properties have hard wired alarms. That's just about all I am doing now.

I would say heat and CO in the living room / kitchen and a smoke in each bedroom should cover it.

I hope it's a top floor flat with a loft otherwise I don't envy you the task of wiring those with no access to the floor above.

 

[Revved Up Sparky]

From 1st December it's the law here that rental properties have hard wired alarms. That's just about all I am doing now.

I would say heat and CO in the living room / kitchen and a smoke in each bedroom should cover it.

I hope it's a top floor flat with a loft otherwise I don't envy you the task of wiring those with no access to the floor above.

Thanks Dave, yes it's a top floor flat so there is an attic above.

 

[kerching]

I believe CO detectors are only required if there is a solid fuel burning appliance...which you have.

It seems odd to me that there does not appear to be a requirement when there are Gas appliances...yet you hear of cases of blocked flues, incorrectly set jets etc...or am I missing something?

 

[Sharpend]

We have been fitting CO's in vicinity of gas boilers for a while now, appears as standard spec on HA's housing. I always thought that the CO's are required wherever a fuel is burnt?

 

[Essex1]

I think you are right sharp boy.

 

[ProDave]

I definitely fit them where there is  gas boiler or gas fire.

 

[kerching]

I definitely fit them where there is  gas boiler or gas fire.

This is what I thought....but i am sure I. Have seen the words "solid fuel"

Just saying

 

[NozSpark]

I've also seen that.....

However.... my fathers uncle and aunt were killed by carbon monoxide poisoning in a caravan, 60 years ago, so IMHO it applies to gas as well..

although, modern boilers are room sealed so any co2 will be vented outside through the flue....

 

[steptoe]

if,

they are sealed properly and not faulty.

what about that idiot plumber/gasman that murdered his girlfriend and her daughter by running a genny inside a boat and modifying the exhaust?  :shakehead

 

[Essex1]

You cannot legislate for mad people.

 

[Rob_the_rich]

smoke alarms wont detect cigarette smoke. You can get cigarette detectors, but they can be disabled if battery operated and can be activated by toasters etc in the kitchen (and open fire) if hardwired and can be expensive.

The heat detector in the kitchen may be activated by the open fire.

The smoke detector in the living room may be activated by toasters etc. and by the open fire

Tricky one

So the landlord doesn't want a smoker, but allows an open fire?

 

[steptoe]

smoke alarms wont detect cigarette smoke. You can get cigarette detectors, but they can be disabled if battery operated and can be activated by toasters etc in the kitchen (and open fire) if hardwired and can be expensive.

The heat detector in the kitchen may be activated by the open fire.

The smoke detector in the living room may be activated by toasters etc. and by the open fire

Tricky one

So the landlord doesn't want a smoker, but allows an open fire?

you sure about that?

we ran out of canned smoke testing a residential home once, and as the only smoker on the crew that day,

I almost killed my yearly quota in one day testing the remainder of the heads,

ok, it wasnt an instant alarm, but, it did set them off,

 

[Rob_the_rich]

you sure about that?

we ran out of canned smoke testing a residential home once, and as the only smoker on the crew that day,

I almost killed my yearly quota in one day testing the remainder of the heads,

ok, it wasnt an instant alarm, but, it did set them off,

I stand corrected, I can imagine it would work in close proximity, up a ladder

but it wouldn't deter a determined smoker. I wouldn't have a dedicated circuit for the alarms either, if they are going to smoke and switch it off at the CU, they can do it in the dark.

 

[Lurch]

This is what I thought....but i am sure I. Have seen the words "solid fuel"

Part k I think it is, CO detector should be within 2m horizontally of any solid fuel burning appliances, or words to that effect.

 

[steptoe]

I stand corrected, I can imagine it would work in close proximity, up a ladder

but it wouldn't deter a determined smoker. I wouldn't have a dedicated circuit for the alarms either, if they are going to smoke and switch it off at the CU, they can do it in the dark.

thinking about it though,

would normal domestic smoke detectors be different?

and would optical or ionisation react in different ways too?

mmmmmmm   :C

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

although, modern boilers are room sealed so any co2 will be vented outside through the flue....

Not wishing to be pedantic but CO2 is what makes fizzy drinks fizzy.

Carbon monoxide is CO it is the bi-product of improper combustion.

Carbon monoxide can be produced by either solid or gas fuel improperly burning.

There is such a thing as a cigarette smoke detector. When it detects fag smoke it speaks.

Click here

There is a video of the original see

https://www.youtube.com/embed/_WruQRcwB5o?feature=oembed

 

[Revved Up Sparky]

Great feedback as always, thanks all :Applaud