Wireless Alarm With Cctv?

[Andycrunch]

Hi All

Ive just purchased my first house and would like to protect it as much as i can! ive been looking recently at Wireless alarm systems (As im a techy and hate cables!) such as infinite prime, Yale etc and i cant figure out what exactly i need. I want to have the following if possible:

• Alarm thats able to text or call when its triggered, also can be disarmed remotley
• Allows me to add wireless extras like smoke alarms, extra door and PIR devices
• Can add CCTV onto it

Im not sure if all this is possible in one alarm so if i cant add CCTV onto it what would be the best alarm to choose for what i need. Looking at the infinite prime, you can add smoke alarms, Carbon monoxide detector, even a flood dectector so would this be the best one?

Thanks in advance.

Andy

 

[steptoe]

You're a techie,

You hate cables,

Bit of a funny one that,

Basically, if you want a good alarm that is reliable you will have cables,

Wireless anything has holes and is not secure.

 

[Doc Hudson]

Welcome to the forum. As Steptoe points out you actually have two issues; first finding a system with all of the features that you want to have and second, your statement that you would like to protect your home as much as you can. Looking at the reliability of the protection system; If you want to guarantee full wireless coverage and operation you either need to obtain some of the kit you are interested in and try it in your property or attempt to get a guarantee from the manufactures as to its coverage and signal strength etc. Consider the average domestic property which is most likely to have dead spots for both its mobile phone and wireless internet coverage. A wireless alarm system will also have dead spots dependent upon the structure of your property. Then even if you have good coverage a lot of the off the shelf systems can be susceptible to interference from other electrical noise and other wireless devices around the home. Then you have to consider the regular maintenance to ensue the batteries are all functioning in all of the remote devices. Unlike with mobile phone and internet, the remote alarm devices do not typically have rechargeable batteries on a regular trickle charge off a mains supply. A correctly installed wired system will give more reliability and longer lifespan between any routine maintenance work. 

Doc H.

 

[Andycrunch]

ive spent 15 years wiring server rooms, office networks, etc and thought i could have an easy life with a wireless system. I understand Wireless can be flakey but if done properly i thought could be good, im guessing im wrong here? could you recommend any wired or good wireless systems at all?

Hi Doc

Thanks for the reply, that makes a lot of sense, pardon my ignorence in wired systems as again im new to all this but with a wired system, would even things like PIR sensors need to be wired? or are those wireless?

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

With wired systems everything has to have a cable

Radio (wireless) systems have come along way and as such are much better than they were, BUT as said, each device, be that PIR, door contact, or duel tech has to have a battery, typically costing £4 that's not too bad but when you have to get 10 that's £40 on batteries, yes you can buy cheaper ones but they do not last as long so cost more in the long run and say they have to be changed every other year, the price of batteries never comes down.

Another thing is the initial cost, a very good radio PIR costs close to £50, where as a better wired PIR doesn't even cost £10 Similar story for door contacts £20 for a good radio one, £1 for a wired one, don't even ask about the smoke detectors.

A radio alarm is quick to install, a wired alarm takes longer but costs considerably less and is overall more reliable.

As for which make is best, ask say 20 people what they like and you will get 20 different replies, as you will be having to use it everyday its up to you which kit you like best.

 

[binky]

checkout Visionic Power max system, not overexpensive, quite expandable, and will take upto 4 CCTV cameras.

 

[steptoe]

With wired systems everything has to have a cable

Radio (wireless) systems have come along way and as such are much better than they were, BUT as said, each device, be that PIR, door contact, or duel tech has to have a battery, typically costing £4 that's not too bad but when you have to get 10 that's £40 on batteries, yes you can buy cheaper ones but they do not last as long so cost more in the long run and say they have to be changed every other year, the price of batteries never comes down.

Another thing is the initial cost, a very good radio PIR costs close to £50, where as a better wired PIR doesn't even cost £10 Similar story for door contacts £20 for a good radio one, £1 for a wired one, don't even ask about the smoke detectors.

A radio alarm is quick to install, a wired alarm takes longer but costs considerably less and is overall more reliable.

As for which make is best, ask say 20 people what they like and you will get 20 different replies, as you will be having to use it everyday its up to you which kit you like best.

not strictly true,

you can buy a wireless add-on that will make a zone wireless,

thats what I have for my shed PIR

but, they are not cheap, iro 60£ IIRC for the kit.

 

[Sidewinder]

Steps,

That would make part of the system wireless, so epic fail!

 

[steptoe]

Steps,

That would make part of the system wireless, so epic fail!

:C

i know,

i know,

my point was that if you truly have somewhere that is simply impractical to wire a detector to it doesnt mean you have to install a totally wireless system,

myself,

well in my infinite wisdom i put all new floors down and didnt put any wires in for an alarm,  :Blushing

i still managed to install a wired system with the only visible wires going to the fire escape window contact upstairs,

so with some thought it is sometimes possible to retrofit a wired system without too much hassle.

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

not strictly true,

you can buy a wireless add-on that will make a zone wireless,

thats what I have for my shed PIR

but, they are not cheap, iro 60£ IIRC for the kit.

But as said, that then makes it wireless.

 

[steptoe]

But as said, that then makes it wireless.

mmm,

well it makes one part wireless,

meaning that you have ONE weakness in the system, not a complete system that is weak,

a weak protection is better than no protection at all,

a bit like putting a padlock on the shed, its better than not locking the shed at all, imho.

if you leave the house do you lock it? or do you not even bother with putting a door on at all?

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

I am not even considering the vulnerability (or any similar issue) of using radio devices, my whole point is that such as you describe, means the system is no longer hard wired.

You could call it a hybrid, which takes us back to what I said.

With wired systems everything has to have a cable

If it has no cable and uses radio, its wireless, if its wireless, it can't be a wired system.

At the end of the day call it what you like, but are we not trying to help / expalin to Andycrunch which is which.

 

[steptoe]

Im sorry,

I disagree,

its a wired system,

how do PIRs work?

you have simply wired a detector onto a zone that uses an RF signal to trigger,

PIRs use light/heat signals to trigger, are they wireless?

door contacts use magnetic forces to trigger, are they wireless?

this is totally different to using a wireless system that uses wireless to transmit a trigger back to the panel,

the triggers are all hard wired, its what makes the trigger that is not, unless you have a pressure mat.

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

Let us agree to disagree.

 

[Andycrunch]

Hi guys

Thanks for the info, the trouble i have with wired is, if you have to stick a PIR sensor in the top corner of a room, dont you have to have a wired trailing down the wall? or having to stick some conduit down the wall to hide it? the walls are in pretty good shape so i dont really want to start drilling them. i do agree though look at expandable options the wired accessories are considerably cheaper than the wireless, i decided just to buy a smoke decetor as the wireless ones cost like £50 each!. It seems like most people on this post have wired ones?

 

[NozSpark]

AFAIAA smokes connected to security alarm panels don't comply with the fire alarm regs... personally id never do it.

If you put the PIRs close to the ceiling then you'd never see the cable, if you have coving then use a long drill on a shallow angle to drill behind the coving

 

[Doc Hudson]

Hi guys

Thanks for the info, the trouble i have with wired is, if you have to stick a PIR sensor in the top corner of a room, dont you have to have a wired trailing down the wall? or having to stick some conduit down the wall to hide it?

There are numerous other ways to install cables other than clipped to the surface or in trunking or conduit. Any electrician who is any good will have no trouble concealing cables. Most domestic light switches and sockets are flush fitted with buried cables concealed within the fabric of the building. As these cables are larger than alarm cables it would not be very hard to conceal the wiring to all of the alarm system components. 

Doc H

 

[Richard-the-Ninth]

As said, you don't very often have a wire running up to a pir in the corner.

The best way to do it is to figure out where the cable runs will go before you do anything (after deciding where the detectors are to go)

Taking a pir in a corner as an example, you poke a small hole in the ceiling where the detector is to go, feed some alarm cable up the hole, go up stairs pull the carpet back, make a hole above where the pir cable is use a bent coat hanger to fish and pull the cable out, pull enough through so that it will reach where the control panel is, cut it off and run the cable to where the panel is going to go.

It does take time, but it is worth it.

The other option is to lift complete floorboards and run the cable either between joists or drill a small hole through every one until it reaches the control panel. (Obviously then put everything else back)

 

[Gerrywan]

Even wireless kits usually need cables. If you want a secure signal you really should go for a wired option, as wireless signals can be very weak when even a single brick wall comes in to effect.