Certificationh

[m4tty]

Hi,

I've been asked to finish second fix as the sparks doing the rewire has had arguement with customer and won't complete it. Hes saying that the smokes have to go on own circuit and there's not enough spare ways in the cu, but I'm sure these can be added to local lighting circuit.

If I go complete second fix and I've been asked to certificate it. What exactly can I certificate as I didn't do first fix and it's all been plastered etc.

Thanks in Advance for any help on this one.

Cheers

 

[matt.leung]

it can go on a lighting circuit.. and is prob better, as if it trips u r gonna know about it....

i would not sign off the second fix, if u did not do the first fix....

 

[ianmacd]

You will need a multipart 7671 cert and you can sign the I&T part but not the design. Original sparks would need to sign that. As for Part P, thats a question that the homeowner needs to take up with LABC directly as you can not sign that off either.

Only other option if you need to sign all the certs is to rip out the existing cables and put new ones in since they have been covered up.

 

[PC Electrics]

Some useful info here about how to wire the smokes into the lights:

http://www.talk.electricianforum.co.uk/showthread.php?p=116683#post116683

The client may well have had an upset with the original spark who carried out first fix, but that spark is still required to issue a certificate to cover the work he has done. Whether the whole job is finished or not this doesn't change. The client should therefore call the original spark and ask for the EIC with the works done appropriately described. The original spark should also notify the works he has completed. A complaint to his scheme would be in order if he refuses.

You may then complete the job and issue your certificate describing the works you have carried out, and notify your part of the job.

The compliance certificate always carries a clause about refering to issued certificates for full descriptions of work carried out.

Also make sure you have a signed and sealed contract detailing where your responsibilities begin and end.

 

[Andy™]

The original spark should also notify the works he has completed. A complaint to his scheme would be in order if he refuses.

and would you be happy notifying a job that you half done and someone else finished?

 

[a1spark]

You will need a multipart 7671 cert and you can sign the I&T part but not the design. Original sparks would need to sign that. As for Part P, thats a question that the homeowner needs to take up with LABC directly as you can not sign that off either.Only other option if you need to sign all the certs is to rip out the existing cables and put new ones in since they have been covered up.

Hi, Ian, that still leaves the declaration for the construction of the installation ,who would you say signs that part ?

 

[Andy™]

Hi, Ian, that still leaves the declaration for the construction of the installation ,who would you say signs that part ?

both

 

[batty]

I would not take on somebody elses work just my point of view. So he has fallen out just over the consumer unit not being large enough?

 

[a1spark]

How would that work then Andy ? Do you mean two signatures on the one Cert ? if so how would both parties accuratley demostrate which part of the work their signature endorses .

 

[Andy™]

How would that work then Andy ? Do you mean two signatures on the one Cert ? if so how would both parties accuratley demostrate which part of the work their signature endorses .

document who done what on another attached sheet to go with EIC

 

[initforthemoney]

Not this old chestnut again.

Just speak to the LABC and tell them the score.

Do the work, issue PIR....done.

No need to make it hard work.

 

[Andy™]

Not this old chestnut again.Just speak to the LABC and tell them the score.

Do the work, issue PIR....done.

No need to make it hard work.

a PIR is a report on existing wiring. it cannot be used when you have done work. EIC or MWC is required for your work

 

[ianmacd]

The owner needs to contact LABC not the installer.

 

[steptoe]

is this the old (Ive got my mate from the pub to wire it) but I need a cert so can you 2nd fix for me cheaply as all the hard work has been done and give me my cert?

 

[batty]

is this the old (Ive got my mate from the pub to wire it) but I need a cert so can you 2nd fix for me cheaply as all the hard work has been done and give me my cert?

Sounds about right surely they would not have paid sparks money if they had fallen out.

 

[initforthemoney]

Yes it is up to the owner, but he can do it.

Most homeowners havent got a clue about this sort of thing anyway.

 

[PC Electrics]

is this the old (Ive got my mate from the pub to wire it) but I need a cert so can you 2nd fix for me cheaply as all the hard work has been done and give me my cert?

It certainly could be. M4tty is suggesting in his OP that it's the spark who is refusing to come back.

Do you know who the spark is? Have you spoken to him? Do you have any independant evidence (from another trade for example) that there even was another spark on the job?

If there was a genuine spark who has completed first fix and put in the CU (but didn't connect), then he is duty bound to do an EIC for his work. He could notify it as "partial rewire".

When you complete you do an EIC for your work and you could notify as "new CU" and "new circuits".

If you see no evidence of any sparks involvement, then you should advise the owner to contact LABC to clear up the sign off issue before you can finish the job off.

Bear in mind also that if there was another spark, then what was the fallout over? Was it really over a seperate circuit for smokes? (I've met several NIC sparks who claim the NIC handbook insists smokes should be on a seperate circuit - don't know if this is true or not as I don't have said handbook, but there are sparks who believe this to be the case). There are always two sides to any fallout and it may be this is an awkward customer, so watch your back.

 

[a1]

Can't remember where I read it (and I agree with it anyway - and I have mentioned this on this forum previously)...

If doing a re-wire, put smokes on seperate circuit

If called in just to fit smokes - if possible - put on own circuit, else add them to existing lighting circuit.

• Yes, you know they will be off, if your lighting circuit fails.
  

• But there again, you know they will be off (on their own dedicated circuit) when it goes off. When the batteries run out - they will be beeping constantly.
  

PC... The NICEIC AC sparks who re-wired my house (Council), added the smokes to a lighting circuit.

 

[PC Electrics]

Can't remember where I read it (and I agree with it anyway - and I have mentioned this on this forum previously)...If doing a re-wire, put smokes on seperate circuit

If called in just to fit smokes - if possible - put on own circuit, else add them to existing lighting circuit.

• Yes, you know they will be off, if your lighting circuit fails.
  

• But there again, you know they will be off (on their own dedicated circuit) when it goes off. When the batteries run out - they will be beeping constantly.

PC... The NICEIC AC sparks who re-wired my house (Council), added the smokes to a lighting circuit.

Smokes beeping with dead batteries (and no mains), huh? How does that work then?

 

[initforthemoney]

There is no requirement to have smokes, rewire or otherwise, on a dedicated circuit.