Dual earths on socket outlets

[lamp-not-bulb]

Hi all...

First post on here, just wanted to get people's view on a situation I've encountered. I helped out another sparks with some 2nd fixing, putting on switches and sockets etc. When the sparks went back to the job he noticed that I had not separated the earths and utilised the dual earth lugs on the back of the socket, I had put 2 x earths into one lug. The guy I did the job for wasn't happy with this and insisted that he would now have to take off every socket and split the earths and that he would not be paying me the full day. I said this is  OTT and asked what was his reasoning? he said his NAPIT assessor had specifically stated that the dual earth lugs MUST be used if there are 2 x cpc and 2 x lugs available, in case one pops out ??  I have only really ever separated the earths on a high integrity circuit in an office OR IT room etc , never felt the need in a domestic situation. 

What's the general thought's from other sparks ?

 

[ProDave]

Personally I think you now have double the number of connections and therefore double the chance of one falling out and breaking the earth.

You will be telling me next that as there are 2 earth terminals, he needs to put a short length of earth jumper wire between them (yes seen that before)

The moral of the story. Choose sockets with only one earth terminal.

To shut him up ask him for the reg number that states you must use both.

 

[lamp-not-bulb]

My thoughts exactly, I would think 2 conductors slotted in under 1 screw terminal had a better chance of not slipping out ...

I asked him for the reg that states it... still waiting.

 

[Evans Electric]

Either way would do for me  TBH  ..I 'm still forgetting to use both terminals.half the time.      But  when you have someone checking jobs & picking flies  you have to start working to their spec. TBH    

That does not alter the fact that the guy is a **** . 

Don't know where this came from ,  I don't recall reading it in the Regs TBH .  

I can tell you when it first came out  we were told it was to reduce harmonics in IT circuits   :C

Then that became  rings only , to ensure at least one earth is still connected .  

Obviously if you do it on radials  you could lose all the other sockets ....Oh no  just remembered ..'arnt we supposed to run a separate earth  to the end of radials now ?      

I lose track , its an age thing you know . 

 

[Sidney]

And here's me thinking the additional termination point was for an additional earth if we had to use a high integrity circuit for IT systems?

 

[kerching]

Your NAPIT assessor is a thick tw@ who needs to read a regs book

others may have a differing opinion but are WRONG

 

[Blue Duck]

What if you were fitting metal faceplates? 

Usually done whatever is best at the time & given situation.

As long as it's earthed, right?

 

[Andy™]

you will need to use both earth terminals with a CPC in each, and connected to different terminals int he DB if you are wiring to high integrity earthing for computers etc ut for general use then either both CPC in same temrinal or seperate, makes no difference

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Hi all...

First post on here, just wanted to get people's view on a situation I've encountered. I helped out another sparks with some 2nd fixing, putting on switches and sockets etc. When the sparks went back to the job he noticed that I had not separated the earths and utilised the dual earth lugs on the back of the socket, I had put 2 x earths into one lug. The guy I did the job for wasn't happy with this and insisted that he would now have to take off every socket and split the earths and that he would not be paying me the full day. I said this is  OTT and asked what was his reasoning? he said his NAPIT assessor had specifically stated that the dual earth lugs MUST be used if there are 2 x cpc and 2 x lugs available, in case one pops out ??  I have only really ever separated the earths on a high integrity circuit in an office OR IT room etc , never felt the need in a domestic situation. 

What's the general thought's from other sparks ?

You are right, he is wrong..

Ask him to go and read  section 543.7  

specifically  543.7.1.203 & 543.7.1.204...

Based on his theory about wires popping out...

I wonder how he would suggest you connected three CPC's if you happened to have a spur of your ring??

Where would the third go?

Do I need to patent a new socket with Three CPC  lugs???

Dragons Den.. Here I come.    :happybunny:

Unless he can provided another reg to the contrary insist upon your full payment due.

:shakehead

 

[lamp-not-bulb]

Thanks for the replies. He did come out with some bull**** that he's spoken to two there qualified supervisors on different sites about and they agreed with him .... ahem....

If he came back with some hard facts/logic then I would stand corrected BUT with sentences like 'you have to use them cos they are there' and 'it's in case one pops out' don't really win the argument. 

Interestingly, yesterday I fitted a double socket with USB ports (client purchased) and on the back was 2 x separate earth lugs BUT next to one it said 'for IT use only' .... maybe they are now putting that on to eradicate confusion.

 

[kerching]

Over the years I have installed hundreds of MK 'T' bar earth sockets. They have 2 lugs so one can be used for 'clean earth ' and the other 'protective earth'. They even came with a link between the two lugs so you could separate them for clean use ....and a little pack of stickers so you could label socket accordingly

in your case I feel that the NAPIT inspector needs to go back to his former job in the 24 hr Key Cutting bar

 

[lamp-not-bulb]

Just to clarify ... I'm QS with NICEIC it was the other sparks that is with 'NAPIT'.... 

 

[Jono Pashley]

/r/thathappened

 

[kerching]

opcorn :coffee

 

[lamp-not-bulb]

Thanks for all the responses guys... makes me feel a bit better. The geezer made me start to doubt myself for some reason