Earth bonding on street furniture

[keets1982]

Hi, I'm looking for some advice. I work as an engineer for a company that carries out works in bus shelters. As per the below. I'm of the belief this enclosure cover should be earth bonded?

 

[Sharpend]

Normally I’d expect an earth fly lead as in lampposts, however is it any different to a socket front? It has fixed screw locations?

 

[binky]

Bonding doors on pillars and other items seems to be the 'norm', although I'm not convinced it's doing anything half the time?

 

[Geoff1946]

I don't know if it's just customary but I've rarely seen an access panel or door which didn't have a bonding link.

 

[Fleeting]

The door should not require an earth. For street furniture removal of a door should not allow access to live parts and single insulated conductors, there must be internal barriers so the OPs is not compliant. Would I earth the enclosure, yes.

 

[binky]

The door should not require an earth. For street furniture removal of a door should not allow access to live parts and single insulated conductors, there must be internal barriers so the OPs is not compliant. Would I earth the enclosure, yes.

I has a long argument once with the head of electrical engineering of my local council who was maoning that we had not bonded a door of an enlcosure that contained all type II equipment and armoured cable.

 

[Sharpend]

The door should not require an earth. For street furniture removal of a door should not allow access to live parts and single insulated conductors, there must be internal barriers so the OPs is not compliant. Would I earth the enclosure, yes.

This isn’t @Fleeting going against the regs is it???

 

[Sidewinder]

It has no fixed lugs and is entirely painted, with no reliable path for boding the lid back to the main enclosure.
Cables and terminations under undue mechanical strain, ergo a risk of pull out and contact with the lid, thus bond the lid & re-terminate and support the cables.
Basic insulation accessible within the enclosure, thus needs to be accessible only to skilled or instructed persons with the use of a tool, a key is a tool in this instance, but a coin is not.

 

[keets1982]

The door should not require an earth. For street furniture removal of a door should not allow access to live parts and single insulated conductors, there must be internal barriers so the OPs is not compliant. Would I earth the enclosure, yes.

Thanks for the reply. Forgive my ignorance but could you explain why it’s non compliant.

 

[Fleeting]

Thanks for the reply. Forgive my ignorance but could you explain why it’s non compliant.

The door cannot be used as a primary barrier there must be basic protection behind it. Removing the door on yours allows access to basic insulation this is not permitted there must be another barrier. See Regulation 714.411.2.201.

 

[Sidewinder]

Basic protection appears present behind the door of the equipment though.
I can’t see any exposed live parts in the picture.
I would go with the equipment being IP 4x?

 

[ruggedscot]

trouble is there appears to be a flex cable that does not have two layers of insulation . hence the lid needs to be secured in such a way that a tool is needed to open.

 

[Fleeting]

trouble is there appears to be a flex cable that does not have two layers of insulation . hence the lid needs to be secured in such a way that a tool is needed to open.

No you are misunderstanding. The door is not a layer of protection you must imagine it doesn't exist @Sidewinder is confusing with misinformation. When it comes to street furniture the access door is irrelevant when it comes to protection it is merely a means of access. Behind this access door there must be further barriers to prevent access to live parts and basic insulation.

 

[Sidewinder]

No you are misunderstanding. The door is not a layer of protection you must imagine it doesn't exist @Sidewinder is confusing with misinformation. When it comes to street furniture the access door is irrelevant when it comes to protection it is merely a means of access. Behind this access door there must be further barriers to prevent access to live parts and basic insulation.

I am not confusing with misinformation.
Read the clause in BS7671.

 

[Fleeting]

I am not confusing with misinformation.
Read the clause in BS7671.

Which clause?

 

[Sidewinder]

My highlighting.
It offers the option of basic insulation, barriers, or enclosures, excluding the door.
That picture shows basic insulation is present.
Thus, unfortunately, it is compliant with BS 7671.

 

[ruggedscot]

Expect this to be classed as C2 – POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS if the basic insulation is unsheathed anywhere where it may be accessible to touch. the picture showing the cable quite clearly missing a sheath

This fault may attract a C3 – IMPROVEMENT RECOMMENDED code if the cable is in an area not accessible to touch.

Regardless of whether accessible to touch or not, unsheathed basic insulation should not be in contact with metallic enclosure/sharp edges, this would be a C2 – POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS issue

So it does fall foul of the BS7671

 

[Sidewinder]

Expect this to be classed as C2 – POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS if the basic insulation is unsheathed anywhere where it may be accessible to touch. the picture showing the cable quite clearly missing a sheath

This fault may attract a C3 – IMPROVEMENT RECOMMENDED code if the cable is in an area not accessible to touch.

Regardless of whether accessible to touch or not, unsheathed basic insulation should not be in contact with metallic enclosure/sharp edges, this would be a C2 – POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS issue

So it does fall foul of the BS7671

Which clause in BS7671 would you be measuring this against?
Section 714 disagrees with you.

 

[binky]

Expect this to be classed as C2 – POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS if the basic insulation is unsheathed anywhere where it may be accessible to touch. the picture showing the cable quite clearly missing a sheath

You could say that about every metal consumer unit and 3 phase board.

 

[ruggedscot]

Which clause in BS7671 would you be measuring this against?
Section 714 disagrees with you.

Soo by your reckoning you can have cables without the sheath out without protection. Section 714 doesnt agree or disagree...