EICR Unsatisfactory - need advice

[J Gough]

We had a EICR done last year, and it came back as unsatisfactory with the following faults:

1)  4.19 No RCD protection for fault protection  C2

2)  4.20 No RCD protection for additional protection  C2

3)  5.12.3 No RCD protection for circuits buried in floors walls ceilings  C3

4)  8.1 No RCD protection for circuits entering special location  C2

5)  No cooker outlet present   C2

I'm a little confused about these though. We're trying to sell the property and the buyer is now digging her feet in at the very last minute over these (which we think is unfair).

Some questions about the C2s:

1, 2 & 4) I can see we don't have an RCD here for circuits 1&3 (2 is not used).  We had low-voltage lights added to circuit 3 in 2011 and have a compliance certificate from the time of installation, but I think the new regs mean that this is no longer compliant and needs to be on a separate circuit?

Is there an easy way to make this compliant on this consumer unit?  We were told by the electrician who did the report that it's impossible as there is not enough space and we'd need an entire new consumer unit installed at great cost.  Is there any way this is avoidable?

For reference, 1 is Cooker, 2 Unused, 3 is Lights, a Sockets, b Shower, c Sheds

5) We've got a switch for the oven, but it does not have a light on it.  Could this be why it has failed here?  Is it simply a case of installing a new one with a light?

Thank you so much in advance for your help!

 

[Murdoch]

Why did you have the EICR?

Upgrading the cu to add RCD protection may not be possible, it's a very old unit.

A new cu shouldn't be to expensive, especially given how much houses cost, what were you quoted?

As for the oven, I don't understand the coding

 

[J Gough]

We let out the property for 10 months whilst out of the country so needed it for that.

 

[Murdoch]

I would get a couple of quotes for replacing the fuse board. Make sure the quote includes part P labc notification

Where in the UK are you? 

 

[Blue Duck]

No cooker outlet? Just a cable poking out the wall? 

I'm guessing you have purchased an ex council property (in Hackney h34r: ) an you want to rent it out, at least you have got an EICR done.

Needs a new consumer unit (I guess that's what the tester is fishing for).

Those old crabtree boards are built to last but parts are getting rarer and more expensive so a new CU would be the best option.

Put it on eBay after though!

Everything else should be in place unless the kitchen fitters cut them pesky green n yella cables, should be a straightforward job.

Is it in a mantel unit (metal box)?

 

[Evans Electric]

That board is the original Crabtree Starbreaker I think  and  as far as I know  you can't get additional RCBOs for them .

I'd say the best option is to replace the board , no need for additional testing is there ?  Seeing as its being done BECAUSE of a test ....theres actually not much wrong is there  ...just RCDs  needed to meet the latest Regs   .  That board was installed to the 16th edition of the Regs  AND was considered the safest of the safe by ALL the experts  back then .   Then those same experts upgrade the Regs and all of a sudden their rules become rubbish. 

Change the board  J Gough  ..about £450  tops ..local sparks , no travelling... in this area I'd say .      How much have you been quoted?   

 

[ProDave]

I am sure I replied earlier but it didn't post for some reason.

So it's failed an EICR for no rcd on cooker and lights?  Since when did it become a requirement of an eicr to judge an install by current regs and only issue a satisfactory if up to current regs?

I would not normally give an unsatisfactory for that, if that was all that was "wrong"

 

[Andy™]

same here, C3 for the non-RCD side

still not sure how no cooker outlet is a C2 though...

 

[ProDave]

I would go back to the original tester, and ask him why he is judging it to current standards. All those should be C3's and the report should be "satisfactory"  If he won't change it, I would tell him he is incompetent and you want a refund and get someone else to do it.
 

 

[J Gough]

Thanks for all the comments.  We're in Cambridge, and we were quoted a price of around £800 for a new board.  However just today our house buyer has forced us to drop the price of the property by £500 because of this.  She left it until last minute before exchange and has us in a corner now else the housing chain collapses.  No time to get it fixed before we move in two weeks.  Really angry but not much we can do.

That's very interesting about being judged against the new regs if it shouldn't have been.  I wonder if we can get anyone to reinspect it and judge it on the old regs at time of installation?

 

[ProDave]

That £800 for a new CU confirms he is just out to rip you off I am afraid, and it looks like it has cost you money.

(no doubt someone will be along in a minute to explain how £800 for a CU change is a fair price)
 

 

[steptoe]

tbh, guessing at the price of a house in Cambridge, is £500 such a big hit?

You get the sale, less hassle, and everyone is 'kinda' happy,?

Still doesn't excuse the incompetent EICR though 

Who done the EICR, you or buyer,?

 

[Andy™]

any EICR is done to current regs regardless of installation age. however, just because something complied with a previous version but not current does not necessarily mean an unsatisfactory report

 

[steptoe]

That £800 for a new CU confirms he is just out to rip you off I am afraid, and it looks like it has cost you money.

(no doubt someone will be along in a minute to explain how £800 for a CU change is a fair price)
 

I don't think it has cost that much @ProDave

At £350 for a CU change round here, I'd guess 450-600£ for one in Cambridge is prob a fair price, so taking 500£ off price isn't so bad.

 

[New Venture!]

CU change prices in Kent are rising. Went to a job yesterday to quote for a new board. Customer had already had a price of £860 plus VAT plus materials for a pretty straightforward job. 

 

[binky]

nothing wrong with a 16th edition set-up, which is what you have there. Did the sparky come via the estate agent by any chance?

The cooker switch should be failed for having a socket so close to the cooker - easily changed for one without, a cooker outlet point behind the cooker is not essential.

Reckon an RCBO could be fitted in that box, I don't use Crabtree much so don't hold me to that. Failing that add RCDs external to that board for the circuits that haven't currently got RCD protection, say £150 tops. As the house has already been tested a complete board change could be had for say £300, half the work is the testing, though I'm not sure the test cert would be any good given what you have desribed already.

 

[Murdoch]

That £800 for a new CU confirms he is just out to rip you off I am afraid, and it looks like it has cost you money.

(no doubt someone will be along in a minute to explain how £800 for a CU change is a fair price)
 

So how much in the wilds of Scotland then?

 

[ProDave]

So how much in the wilds of Scotland then?

£100 for the CU and allow a full days labour £200 so no more than £300.  Assuming it's not too far away. 
 

 

[steptoe]

nothing wrong with a 16th edition set-up, which is what you have there. Did the sparky come via the estate agent by any chance?

The cooker switch should be failed for having a socket so close to the cooker - easily changed for one without, a cooker outlet point behind the cooker is not essential.

Reckon an RCBO could be fitted in that box, I don't use Crabtree much so don't hold me to that. Failing that add RCDs external to that board for the circuits that haven't currently got RCD protection, say £150 tops. As the house has already been tested a complete board change could be had for say £300, half the work is the testing, though I'm not sure the test cert would be any good given what you have desribed already.

What's wrong with the socket being so close,?

 

[Evans Electric]

I've been picked up  loads of times for judging EICRs  on the Regs prevailing at the time  ...but  I always consider if it was good enough & safe enough then... its  still OK today .    Was also told NOT to refer to the install being ..say 16th  ....  as when you get the tick box  " Are buried cables protected by RCD"   ..I put no 16th edition refers. 

In reality there is nothing wrong with J Gough's installation ..............its done to the 16th edition like millions of others . 

I'm amazed the tester did not condemn the "Inflammable" consumer unit.