extractor fan isolator switch

[NozSpark]

I was under the impression that all "motors" required local isolation... whats going to happen if the motor siezes? how are you going to stop it overheating?

 

[Andy™]

I've encountered a few mains powered smokes fed from a lighting circuit. Yes I know, not good practice.

in my opinion, they are safer on the lighting circuit. if there is a fault on lighting circuit, it doesnt take long to be noticed and repaired. dedicated circuit however, the first time you may know there is a fault is when alarm starts beeping to say its battery is flat. could have been days of weeks with no mains. and as for repair, 'itll get done next week'

 

[spinlondon]

I am refering to the post that references the 1989 Electricity At Work Regulations, the 1999 Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations and the 1998 Provision and Use of Work Equipment Regulations.

Just wondering if the bathroom is part of an installation where theses Regulations are applicable?

 

[Sidewinder]

Yes Spin it is as soon as anyone works in there in the course of their employment end of.

 

[spinlondon]

Do any of these Regulations require that local isolation be provided, or do they just require isolation?

 

[Sidewinder]

They require safe isolation, the requirement for local isolation will depend on the installation and its use.

 

[spinlondon]

They require safe isolation, the requirement for local isolation will depend on the installation and its use.

Yes my understanding, was also that safe isolation is a requirement. Such as would be provided by switching and locking off an MCB/RCBO in the CU, or the removal of a fuse from the CU.

I assume that any requirement for local isolation will be dependant on whether the installation is domestic, or used as a place of work?

 

[Sidewinder]

Not necessarily. it will depend on the use, and other issue, but, not solely on the definition of a work place.

 

[Manator]

Yes my understanding, was also that safe isolation is a requirement.I assume that any requirement for local isolation will be dependant on whether the installation is domestic, or used as a place of work?

What you have to remember also is that in commercial and industrial situations there are now 3 grades of trained person, (used as a loose example), just because the installation is commercial for example does not mean that those restrictions imposed on domestic installations are not imposed on commercial, a large hotel complex for example will require almost the same consideration as a domestic install.

 

[spinlondon]

Not necessarily. it will depend on the use, and other issue, but, not solely on the definition of a work place.

Perhaps you could clarify?

Are there different requirements for bathrooms that are used for bathing to those that are used for showering?

Are thhere requirements for bathrooms containing toilets?

How exactly does local isolation of a domestic bathroom extractor fan fall within the remit of Regulations for the use of any machinery, appliance, apparatus, tool or installation for use at work?

 

[Sidewinder]

Spin,

Where did you get DOMESTIC bathroom from?

Any place of work comes under work place regulations.

If you come to work in my house then once you step through the door my house becomes your place of work, what issue do you have with that?

 

[Manator]

Its often overlooked by most tradesmen who enter a domestic property in their normal course of work.

 

[spinlondon]

You stated in an earlier post that the requirement for local isolation depended on the installation and its use.

I am just asking what requirements do the Regulations you have quoted have for local isolation in a domestic bathroom.

I'm not asking you to quote verbatim the particular Regulations, just their Nos. will be sufficient.

 

[Sidewinder]

Safe isolation in a domestic bathroom would be the statutory requirement as a minimum.

 

[spinlondon]

Safe isolation in a domestic bathroom would be the statutory requirement as a minimum.

Which can be achieved by use of the switch on a MCB/RCBO and appropriate locking off, or by the removal of the relavant fuse.

Obviously proving the circuit was dead with an appropriate tester would also be required, but that would also be neccessary with local isolation.

 

[kme]

I fail to see why there needs to be a huge discussion over a fan isolator switch. Some form of independant isolation is required where the fan is fed from, or utilises the live from, a lighting circuit. Apart from safe isolation etc. and the possibility or other regs applying, surely "minimising inconvenience" is reason enough?

O/P - I believe you`d need to provide a much better course of reasoning to convince ME that you don`t need to fit one - although I`m just a lowly sparx.

Spin - Why the argumentative stance? I fail to understand the reasoning for it - sorry.

If someone / anyone "can`t be bothered" (read ar5ed) to do a job properly, they should be re-training as a traffic warden! My opinion, anyway.

KME

 

[spinlondon]

KME I am not aware that I am arguing, or standing in an argumentative way.

I have just asked for clarification on how Regulations intended for places of work, machinery for work purposes and management of health and safety wilst carrying out work related duties are applicable to local isolation for a domestic bathroom extractor fan.

As per my previous post, furnishing the particular Regulation Nos. will be sufficient.

 

[steptoe]

I fail to see why there needs to be a huge discussion over a fan isolator switch. Some form of independant isolation is required where the fan is fed from, or utilises the live from, a lighting circuit. Apart from safe isolation etc. and the possibility or other regs applying, surely "minimising inconvenience" is reason enough?O/P - I believe you`d need to provide a much better course of reasoning to convince ME that you don`t need to fit one - although I`m just a lowly sparx.

Spin - Why the argumentative stance? I fail to understand the reasoning for it - sorry.

If someone / anyone "can`t be bothered" (read ar5ed) to do a job properly, they should be re-training as a traffic warden! My opinion, anyway.

KME

I dont think applies to spin,

to re-train you have to have first trained as something,

he hasnt even trained as a spark yet going by his post on this most basic of subjects that is isolation.

 

[Sidewinder]

Spin,

As has been stated previously 7671 Reg no's are irrelevant.

You must comply with statutory legislation whilst at work these are the laws I quoted earlier.

IF you feel that you can justify your stance under these laws which you may be prosecuted under and not fit an isolation switch then go ahead and don't bother.

You certainly aint gonna get prosecuted under 7671 as it is not statute law.

You may wish to check the full text of the building regs though, just in case, you feel that the workplace related regs are not worth bothering with.

 

[Manator]

KME I am not awar that I am arguing, or standing in an argumentative way.I have just asked for clarification on how Regulations intended for places of work, machinery for work purposes and management of health and safety wilst carrying out work related duties are applicable to local isolation for a domestic bathroom extractor fan.

As per my previous post, furnishing the particular Regulation Nos. will be sufficient.

And that reply is based on what? Which regulation number would you like to see? Which regulation number do you not approve of?

Like I implied in my above post, as an electrician, place of work is where you will carry out your trade, so not only are you under regulations outside the scope of any particular singular regulation you are bound by others. This is normally never appreciated until a legal case is brought. The insurance companies hold the key, which is why incompetance could be easily proved without the need to quote a regulation.