Rewire Lighting Or Fit Class 2S?

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brummydave

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Been to an old (60s?) flat today to swap strip light in kitchen for 'something modern' (like track lighting) and a double strip light in the bathroom, again for 'something modern' and 'maybe more suitable for a bathroom'. Seems simple enough, but then I discovered only the bath light is earthed - and I'm not sure where to. There is a spurious cable coming from the ceiling in the airing cupboard and is clamped to the water pipe so that may be the mysterious earth!

The lighting circuit is just two wire from a rewireable 5A fuse in a board made by 'Bill'. The incoming cable is something I've never seen before, seems almost MIMS in its appearance, and the earthing is through conduit to the metal meter box. The Ze reading was 0.18 which did give a PFC of 1.4kA.

Unfortunately it's a top floor flat with a flat roof so access above ceilings is negligible!

I've suggested either the lighting circuit is rewired, or at least has an earth cable drawn round (which amounts to the same amount of work really), or I use only new Class 2 fittings.

If I leave the circuit as is, I've identified 3 existing ceiling fittings that are class 1, 3 brass light switches as well as 2 more fittings to be confirmed class 1 or 2. 

On top of this, there's no gas or water bonding and obviously, no RCDs at all.

The customer did then ask if I wanted to fit a new board but I'm not sure how this ties in with an unearthed/class2 circuit.

Any advice please on how to proceed? 

Thanks,

Dave.

 
Are you sure its not in conduit a lot of the 60's flats round my way are wired in metal conduit with the conduit as the earth.

 
Doing a CU change with no CPC on the lighting is okay providing certain conditions are met, there's a guidance note which 'm sure someone will link to shortly.

Here's the double insulated lighting supplier 

http://www.double-insulated-lighting.co.uk/?gclid=CM2wr92s-LYCFdHLtAodDnAAHg

EDIT:

+1 to above. Check for conduit boxes in the ceiling and behind light switches, there may be an earth after all, but nobody has bothered to connect a wire to the conduit box.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Electrical safety council has a best practice guide titled 'Replacing a consumer unit in a domestic premises where lighting circuits have no protective conductor"

which i found very useful. I did a consumer unit change to a premises which had the same problem and used it for a NICEIC assessment one year.

 
Thanks for all the help folks. Amazing stuff. Restored confidence and everything :) :0 :)

There is a company around that does Class 2 decorative lighting Dave, it is cheaper than rewiring the circuit and lets you get the job done to regs.

Andy Guinness
Thanks, I found them through a previous post on Class 2 stuff, but they seem pretty expensive and don't have the style my customer wanted. I guess i should let them look and find a new style! :)

Are you sure its not in conduit a lot of the 60's flats round my way are wired in metal conduit with the conduit as the earth.
This occured in a previous flat I worked on, and i'm not 100% sure in this one as I only had a brief time to inspect today.... but I didn't see any evidence of conduit apart from the incomer to the meter & fuseboard box (i;ll post a pic of this tomoro). The circuit cables disappear from the top of the meter box but not in conduit....

Doing a CU change with no CPC on the lighting is okay providing certain conditions are met, there's a guidance note which 'm sure someone will link to shortly.

Here's the double insulated lighting supplier 

http://www.double-insulated-lighting.co.uk/?gclid=CM2wr92s-LYCFdHLtAodDnAAHg

EDIT:

+1 to above. Check for conduit boxes in the ceiling and behind light switches, there may be an earth after all, but nobody has bothered to connect a wire to the conduit box.
Thanks for the help as well Dave. :) I'll keep me eye out for the guidance note.

Could easily be conduit,,,, but it would be good for you to familiarise yourself with the ESC guides
Thanks, and I will go hunting those guides again. :)

Don't forget the nylon M3.5 screws............ ;)
Not heard of these, are they an addition or a modification?!

Electrical safety council has a best practice guide titled 'Replacing a consumer unit in a domestic premises where lighting circuits have no protective conductor"

which i found very useful. I did a consumer unit change to a premises which had the same problem and used it for a NICEIC assessment one year.

Thanks John and Pewter. Look forward to reading it! :)

 
Nylon screws...............said half in jest hence the wink BUT it can be argued that the ordinary screw that is attached to a metal back box COULD become live. Counter that with the fact that said screw is recessed below the surface, it's a very small hole etc. Not forgetting the possibility of the nylon screw breaking off!

Of course you can get plastic fittings that come with little plastic covers that go in the screw holes....................................................................

 
Nylon screws...............said half in jest hence the wink BUT it can be argued that the ordinary screw that is attached to a metal back box COULD become live. Counter that with the fact that said screw is recessed below the surface, it's a very small hole etc. Not forgetting the possibility of the nylon screw breaking off!

Of course you can get plastic fittings that come with little plastic covers that go in the screw holes....................................................................
lol. of course, i missed the wink. Thanks :)

 
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