Selling Property With No Earthing to Lighting

[fungus1487]

Our property was built in the late 60's and has never been fully rewired. We had a new kitchen installed and on the Electrical Installation Condition Report it was raised as a C1 No Earthing to Lighting throughout the property.

We are now selling our property and wanted to know whether we legally have to get this sorted to be in a state to sell it and how much of an undertaking that actually is if so, I imagine access through the floorboards to get to the ceiling lights and again through the loft for the second floor but would an electrician need to do anything more severe?

 

[Blue Duck]

Put it on for 5k more and when they question it give them 5k off the askin price for a rewire?

 

[fungus1487]

I spose I phrased it wrong, by not doing this work what are we actually limiting? Ability to do future work on ghe property? Or is it legally required? My hunch is that its not required but its just nice to have a compliant certificate.

 

[Lusk]

If you've got plastic light switches etc, it is not a C1 fault.

Report whoever did the inspection to the NICEIC NAPIT etc. and they will put you right!

 

[fungus1487]

Oooh thank you i will check that out.all our switches are indeed plastic.

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

Not just the switches,  the light fittings also  have to be plastic, well actually called class 2.

If your compedent, unscrew a switch. Most lighting  wiring done in the 60's with no earth used back boxes with either plastic or waxed card lugs (the bit the screws go in) so there is no connection between the visible screws and the back box. If yours are like that then no problems. 

 

[Murdoch]

Its possible that the buyers survey will not show up the lack of earthing to the lights UNLESS a "proper" EICR is done.

Lack of earth to lighting is NOT a C1, the best practice guide clearly states this as a C2 however as long as all metal lights and/or switches are be replaced with plastic units - this is not immediately dangerous!

Anyone buying a 1960's house should really have a proper EICR done as part of the purchase (and not rely on one produced by the seller).

 

[NozSpark]

As said above you can get away without having an earth on your lighting, but there are several things that you need in place..

1. There must be no class 1 accessories, that's basically any light fitting or switch that would require an earth

2. The circuit must have 30mA RCD protection

3. You need to have a sticker on your consumer unit letting people know that the particular circuit has no earth

It's not the best option, but it is within the regs..

 

[ProDave]

Get an EICR done by a  competent electrician so it will have a satisfactiory rating and no C1's  (if there are any genuine C1's get them rectified)

that should trump any "survey" and should be good enough for a mortgage provider.

 

[Essex1]

As said above you can get away without having an earth on your lighting, but there are several things that you need in place..

1. There must be no class 1 accessories, that's basically any light fitting or switch that would require an earth

2. The circuit must have 30mA RCD protection

3. You need to have a sticker on your consumer unit letting people know that the particular circuit has no earth

It's not the best option, but it is within the regs..

Where did you get the RCD bit from?  I have never heard that before. 

 

[Davethsparky]

As said above you can get away without having an earth on your lighting, but there are several things that you need in place..

1. There must be no class 1 accessories, that's basically any light fitting or switch that would require an earth

2. The circuit must have 30mA RCD protection

3. You need to have a sticker on your consumer unit letting people know that the particular circuit has no earth

It's not the best option, but it is within the regs..

Its not in the regs, there is no provision for this within the regulations it is something dreamed up by the niceic and their cronies at the ESC 

 

[Murdoch]

As said above you can get away without having an earth on your lighting, but there are several things that you need in place..

1. There must be no class 1 accessories, that's basically any light fitting or switch that would require an earth

2. The circuit must have 30mA RCD protection

3. You need to have a sticker on your consumer unit letting people know that the particular circuit has no earth

It's not the best option, but it is within the regs..

I think you are confusing this with the NICEIC guidance with fitting as new cupboard when the lights don't have an earth.

Just saying

 

[fungus1487]

Thanks for all the help.

As far as I am aware I don't legally have to do anything, if they want an NICEIC cert that passes then I can get away with the above workaround of plastic switches and fittings. Hopefully this will suffice as I have a feeling our buyers may try to bring the price down based on this, in my mind it isn't even a real issue but just something that is quite obviously best practice.

If we was in a position to rewire this would of course happen but it seems like a lot of work and I can't actually see why our buyers would push us into a position to knock money off for it as there is no legal obligation.

 

[Murdoch]

Thanks for all the help.

As far as I am aware I don't legally have to do anything, if they want an NICEIC cert that passes then I can get away with the above workaround of plastic switches and fittings. Hopefully this will suffice as I have a feeling our buyers may try to bring the price down based on this, in my mind it isn't even a real issue but just something that is quite obviously best practice.

If we was in a position to rewire this would of course happen but it seems like a lot of work and I can't actually see why our buyers would push us into a position to knock money off for it as there is no legal obligation.

What's the NICEIC cert mean? And even with plastic accessories you would still get an unsatisfactory EICR imho

 

[Essex1]

What's the NICEIC cert mean? And even with plastic accessories you would still get an unsatisfactory EICR imho

Giving an unsatisfactory comment on an EICR because there is no earth attached to accessories that do not require an earth is a bit harsh. C3 for me. 

 

[fungus1487]

I think the main thing is that these reports are very counter-intuitive if they aren't backed up legally, even if C1's are raised am I legally obligated to even do anything? There just seems so much of a grey area that it's hard to  decide what to do. If C1's are raised I'm pretty sure I can just live with it and accept the risk, when it comes to selling again I don't think legally there is any issue its more just whether the buyers agree with said risk.

Whilst if it was enforced somehow at least it would mean that there is no grey area up for debate and it would either be a requirement or not.

Admittedly I know very little about wiring a household but it feels like all this could be made much clearer.

 

[Murdoch]

The report is a report. You don't have you act on it....... It's your prerogative.

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

If C1's are raised I'm pretty sure I can just live with it and accept the risk,

Now there's the problem. A true C1 you should and possibly could not live with because it is dangerous. A C2 or 3 you may decide to live with because it could become dangerous.

This is why no earth on a lighting circuit alone, is never  a C1.

 

[Murdoch]

Now there's the problem. A true C1 you should and possibly could not live with because it is dangerous. A C2 or 3 you may decide to live with because it could become dangerous.

This is why no earth on a lighting circuit alone, is a C1.

That is rubbish. C1's are things that are IMMEDIATELY dangerous...... which a lighting circuit without a CPC is not

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

That is rubbish. C1's are things that are IMMEDIATELY dangerous...... which a lighting circuit without a CPC is not

My mistake  :Blushing   forgot to put 'never' in. Have edited it now.