Statute Law By John Harris

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Don't really have the 2 hours but may be interesting .   Not really sure where hes  coming from  though,   and  although I love conspiracy theories  I am very wary of them . 

We had a guy on local radio saying the US government planned & carried out  9/11 along with the Fremasons and "proves" it by saying the masonic emblem is on a dollar bill and if you fold the bill a  certain way  it depicts the twin towers on fire (which I have seen before) 

But it has as much credence as Elvis working as a traffic warden in the centre of Birmingham .

 
Only watched a bit but seems a nutter to me....

If he thinks a summons is an "offer" to do anything he must be nuts. A summons [as in the ones the police issue] are all backed up by statute law, and NOTHING comes above staute law. Anyway, a summons [it is to summon you to appear in court] is [the criminal ones] issued by a criminal court that presumably derives its power from the lord chief justice... You might hear talk about arrestable offences. These were formerly ones that on first conviction [from memory] were liable to get you a five year stretch.

Now though, thanks to the operation of S.25 PACE if a policeman thinks he might not be able to arrange for you to appear in court by means of a summons, say he thinks you will just not turn up, or he has doubts about the accuracy of the name you have given him, then ALL offences are arrestable ones.

If you try to resist arrest, the policeman will attempt to restrain you. You then try to forcibly free yourself and you are looking at a minimum 6 months for a start, and that is before they book you with something else too!!!!

Remember you do not even need to have commited an offence [although in general you do] Basically the police can arrest you, for your own protection; Say if they believe you to be ill, like a mental illness or something, they can detain you and cart you off to hospital. You resist, and that is then "obstruction" you carry on, and then you will be arrested anyway, never mind the original power to detain you for your own good..

Now, does any of that sound like an "invitation" or an "offer" ????

Same with fixed penalty notices. Yes, it might be an "offer" to take up the opportunity to go to court if you so wish, but backed up by statute law that provides that if you do not either pay, or take the opportunity to go to court and opt instead to do nothing, then you will be proceeded against in the usual way.

Anyone can win on a technicality if such exists, i have myself on a matter that COULD have got me a £2000 fine and or 6 months in jail. [this "offence" did NOT involve dishonestly, was a point of law regarding firearms licensing many years ago] nothing clever about that.....

The law has teeth, BIG ones...

john....

 
I think he was found out to be a bit of a con man. He used language to try and offer a different point of view. He is claiming that a statute law is a saleable contract to provide revenue. Not sure if he is still around I have not heard anything for a while.

 
My interest is fixed penalty fines.

I have heard some say fines can not be enforced unless it is convicted by a court.

His angle is

-Statute is a contract for commercial, or person. ( not for a freeman)

-common law is for a Human being.

-Statute is a contract to enforce on fictitious persons. It is not law until we consent.

-Example, get a fixed penalty notice, it is an offer (notice) to pay them some money (less to pay now or more in a couple weeks) , there is a clause if you ignore it you consent. He would write back as a human and make them an offer, (as in a question). A speeding fine is not common law so does not apply to a human.

-Common law is injury, harm or loss to others.

-Summons is an offer, as in an offer to go to the court. (courts are registered as a cooperation.)

-Policeman is a person to uphold the law, serve and protect.

-Police Officer is a fiction, that is a corporate employee to uphold statute.

I dont know anything about law, but i would like to know how to lose penalty notice, and if this crackpots system would work.

Im not sure i could be bothered to fight the powers that be.

 
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He is a complete nutcase, trust me...

You will hear halfwits saying that fines can only be enforced by a court, and this is correct.

Lots of "fines" are really "penalties" BUT, you accepted the terms of the contract when you did whatever you did. If it said on the sign that "park here and it will cost you 2 million pounds to get your car back, and then you park there, you have "consented to the risk" and accepted the terms of the contract that can then be enforced against you in a civil court, MAKE NO MISTAKE...

"Proper" fines. NOTHING comes above statute law. If the law requires you to pay a fine, then you will, unless of course, you want to take advantage of the court imposing the custodial alternative instead PLUS a stretch for failure to pay. [if a fine was imposed in the first place and you declined to pay]

As to this nutcases assertion that a summons is an offer to go to court; [that would be invitation anyway, he cannot even speak english properly] he is plainly a nutcase.

If you read a summons, it says that you are "Bailed to appear" If you do not "answer bail" this "bail" will be withdrawn and the court will issue an arrest warrant instead. As soon as the police find you [and they will] you will be locked up until such times as there is a court available.

Bloke is completely raving insane

john...

 
Was he getting mixed up between  , say,  a parking ticket issued by a private company looking after Asda's car park ...and a parking ticket issued by the local council or police .?

Unless I'm mistaken , the private one is in fact an invoice  based on the rules posted onsite  and they  COULD , go through the court to get their money .

I mentioned a while ago ,  Mrs Deke forgot to place Blue Badge on dashboard at Asda , in a disabled bay ..  bright yellow parking ticket  from a company in Scotland  requesting £70   .   Fair enough , wrongful use of the bays is not fair on disabled people , it can be such a blessing to get near to the store .

               Wrote to them ,  photocopy of badge,  shop at Asda every week , silly mistake ..ar'nt I silly.....ticket cancelled .

Being gluttons for punishment , park in Lichfield Market Square ,  display said badge ...10 paces from the car and theres a ticket going on for not setting the cardboard arrival clock because its a 3 hour only bay .   £30 if you pay now....£60 if you leave it  OR   attend Magistrates Court on this date ( Because they have the power to say that )      No messing ..pay up or attend court .

 
I heard another scam where your requested to court to challenge penalty.

The guy checks with court and no record of him to be there.

Turns out council rent the court, rent a judge to rubber stamp stuff so you think it's a proper court fine. Kangaroo court is the term I think.

Apparently there is a few people who have got away with challenging fines. One guy has made a form we all can use to do the same.

My customer and his new found freedom movement is starting to convert me.

Over the time I have rewired a shop and 3 flats for him he has me hooked.

Am I now in a cult?

 
maybe he is a certain member from here trying his legal skills. and by the looks of it, he is just as good at it as he is at electrical... (and its nothing to do with the forum legal guru, either!)

 
pewter said:
I heard another scam where your requested to court to challenge penalty.

The guy checks with court and no record of him to be there.

Turns out council rent the court, rent a judge to rubber stamp stuff so you think it's a proper court fine. Kangaroo court is the term I think.

Apparently there is a few people who have got away with challenging fines. One guy has made a form we all can use to do the same.

My customer and his new found freedom movement is starting to convert me.

Over the time I have rewired a shop and 3 flats for him he has me hooked.

Am I now in a cult?
Click to expand...
Some say you're a right cult  Pewt ,  but don't listen to them !!! :innocent ;)

 
The only way you will win any court case is if you have good evidence to suggest you were not there, did not do it or the alleged offence did not actually take place.

If a prosecution is taken against you that does not follow the proper procedures you may get off on a technicality.

As app 87 says the guys a nut case, and all those who believe him are by definition insane to think that there is a difference between a person, and a human being. To define one is to define the other.

 
All i am saying is this;

Firstly, click on the first link concerning council tax and read carefully. Read the captions on screen. By the time you have reached the thirty second mark you will have noticed the bloke cannot even spell!!!!!!

For the avoidance of any doubt whatsoever...

You fancy not paying council tax, yes??? You want to know what will happen, yes??? Errrrrm, this... [the blue bits in brackets I have added to explain things]

The Council Tax (Administration and Enforcement) Regulations 1992 Commitment to prison

47.  (1)  Where a billing authority [The local authority] has sought to levy an amount by distress [sent bailiffs] under regulation 45, the debtor is an individual who has attained the age of 18 years, and the person making the distress reports to the authority that he was unable (for whatever reason) [including you not letting them in] to find any or sufficient goods of the debtor on which to levy the amount [No stuff to seize], the authority may apply to a magistrates' court for the issue of a warrant committing the debtor to prison.

(2) On such application being made the court shall (in the debtor’s presence) inquire as to his means and inquire whether the failure to pay which has led to the application is due to his wilful refusal or culpable neglect [Tried to be clever, or could not be arsed to pay]

(3) If (and only if) the court is of the opinion that his failure is due to his wilful refusal or culpable neglect it may if it thinks fit—

(a)issue a warrant of commitment [Enjoy the holiday! Note; NOT arrest, instant COMMITMENT TO PRISON] against the debtor, or

[SIZE=12pt](b)fix a term of imprisonment and postpone the issue of the warrant until such time and on such conditions (if any) as the court thinks just.[/SIZE]

This nutcase can think anything he likes, it is all crap!!!!!!!

Tell you what; This fellow thinks that a summons and all the rest rely on you "consenting to have one" Here is a simple every day test, that anyone, [Especially electricians can try]

Step one; SORN your van.

Step two; Now put red diesel in it.

Step three; Drive to your local VOSA centre and show them.

You will find that your vehicle will be siezed. Tell them that "john harris" said that you can ignore the law cos you are a "freeman" Watch how the VOSA staff chuckle with glee and the police turn up.

Tell the police the same; One of two things will now happen;

1, You will be arrested under section 136 of the mental health act by the police and sent to an asylum. [if they are in a good mood]

2, You will be told to clear off home, WITHOUT said van. You must now protest, and say "john harris" said they must leave you alone as you have not consented. Within seconds you will be arrested for one of a raft of public order offences and handcuffed. Then; [in ascending order depending on how much resistance you put up] you will be;

1, put in an armlock.

2, sprayed with CS.

3, TASERED.

4, Shot with a 9mm carbine.

Go try it...................

john......

 
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Oh, by the way, I watched the video, and they claim to have "won" They most certainly did not, as, after listening patiently for a very long time to them all talking a load of rubbish, the magistrates then finally called the defendant to the stand, he did not take the stand, and so, [and it is shown in video No;2 at the 6:47 mark] the liability order WAS issued regardless...

I might as well add, that the reason that the police did not tell everyone to leave the court is that members of the public have a right to attend [as spectators] court hearings, and, as they were not interfering with proceedings, there was no reason to remove them, [remember, the police do not want to provoke unrest] HOWEVER, they COULD, [if the members of the public interfered with court proceedings, have arrested the lot for aggravated trespass.

Now then, a challenge to any doubters out there.

You saw the liability order, NOW TRY AND FIND ANY CLEVER VIDEOS OF MR BARRY EVADING IT'S PROVISIONS.....

Thought not.....

john....

 
Apprentice87 first off, let me say i look up to what you say, your knowledge and i appreciate your time giving your view on this.

I am not planning to avoid paying council tax, though challenging parking wardens interests me. (even though in the last 19 years i have only had 2 parking tickets, 1 i challenged and got off).

My life is challenging enough arguing with my 5 year old over what pink jumper to wear, or the 13 year old about doing his homework and the misses claiming i am not doing some other bollox.

When i am awaiting a bollocking from the misses or kids i do like to read and watch things.

I do like to think outside the box, and just because everyone else does something i am not a fan of just following the crowd. For example, most electricians install 2.5mm ring final circuits, i do not, i think 2 radials is better then 1 ring.

I find the people like 'white rabbit trust' who are challenging the system (mainly the Bankers) and exposing things we the common people were not aware of. The way banks generate 2-3x the money from a loan we take out i find interesting, and how the system is now in a mess from this practice.   I have only been shown this by a customer and i find it interesting. I have another customer who has set up a company to challenge mis sold mortgage products, he was telling me how he got one womans £500k mortgage written off by Barcleys after he had a meeting with there big wigs. I dont even have a bank loan or mortgage, so personally i have nothing to gain.

The other night on BBC was a documentary on the super rich and the trickle down economics which also ties in with all this mess and what people like the white rabbit trust are trying to expose.

Regards your info above,  and please excuse my lack of legal knowledge as i am just a sparky poking his nose in.

Is the Barry chap saying the council tax is for corporation, (our fictional name as a person) to be challenged in a corporation court. He produced his birth certificate which is the fictional person.

I find things they say like the public not standing meaning they dont consent to the jurisdiction of a commercial court, and claiming common law very interesting. I dont know if its right or wrong. The magistrate wanted everyone who did not stand removed and that did not happen. It seemed to me the magistrate was been challenged which was not going down well. I do admire people who stand up to the system and challenge the norm.

I know nothing of common law, corporate law/marine law which they all seem to be going on about. I used to think there was just laws.

Regards your vehicle example. What some of the rebels seem to go on about is not having your vehicle registered, so if its not registered it does not belong to system and then will not have to follow there rules for road tax and insurance. I do not know the implications of using red derv except i am not ment to do it ( i wouldnt even use Tesco Derv in my van let alone red).

What i am pretty sure of, is that the police can not have you sent to an asylum. I believe it takes 2 or 3 doctors to agree on such a thing which is a very hard thing to do.

 
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Hi Pewter,

I have not time to explain the statutory reasons why you have to register insure or tax your vehicle, only that, at the end of the day, if you do not, it will be taken from you and crushed, and if you do not turn up in court to answer the various charges that arise from this you WILL be jailed.......

What you say about the police being able to send you to an asylum is I am afraid incorrect, THEY MOST CERTAINLY CAN and will...... [i have added notes in blue... and the bold type]

Mentally disordered persons found in public places. [section 136 mental health Act 1983]

(1) If a constable finds in a place to which the public have access [Anywhere in practice] a person who appears to him to be suffering from mental disorder and to be in immediate need of care or control, the constable may, if he thinks it necessary to do so in the interests of that person or for the protection of other persons, remove that person to a place of safety within the meaning of section 135. [see the last paragraph for meaning of "place of safety"]

(2) A person removed to a place of safety under this section may be detained there for a period not exceeding 72 hours for the purpose of enabling him to be examined by a registered medical practitioner and to be interviewed by an approved mental health professional and of making any necessary arrangements for his treatment or care. [so, that will see you locked up for 3 days for a start off]

(3) A constable, an approved mental health professional or a person authorised by either of them for the purposes of this subsection may, before the end of the period of 72 hours mentioned in subsection (2) above, take a person detained in a place of safety under that subsection to one or more other places of safety. [Guess where that is going to be???]

(4) A person taken to a place of a safety under subsection (3) above may be detained there for a purpose mentioned in subsection (2) above for a period ending no later than the end of the period of 72 hours mentioned in that subsection.

In this section “place of safety” means residential accommodation provided by a local social services authority under Part III of the National Assistance Act 1948, a hospital as defined by this Act, a police station, an independent hospital or care home for mentally disordered persons or any other suitable place the occupier of which is willing temporarily to receive the patient.

So, the police CAN take you to an asylum, in fact, this is what they will do in practice, they will ONLY stick you in the cells, IF and only if, there is no room in the mental hospital.

Following this, you can be held as i have explained, for 3 days under section 136, during which time you WILL NOT be allowed to leave and WILL be kept there BY FORCE IF NECESSARY.

Next, at some stage during the 3 days [could be a long wait], you will be assessed by a consultant psychiatrist. THEN, you will EITHER be "sectioned" under one of the other sections of the mental health act 1983, OR, you may be released, [and this may have conditions attached].......

Shall i tell you how easily this can happen?????

Ok..... You do NOT have to be a raving madman... Let us imagine that you are in a public place, minding your own business, not hurting anyone, not even making a sound, but appear distressed or upset.

Next, a concerned member of the public phones the police.

The police turn up and will speak to you......

They are normal people like anyone else. If in their judgement you are confused, or delusional, or at risk of harming yourself or another person, you WILL be arrested under section 136.

They might even ask you the famous question, [they ARE trying to help] "can you keep yourself safe" If you answer "NO", you WILL [Once again!] be arrested and taken to the local hospital, you will NOT be permitted to leave, and, if after an initial assessment by an on call psychiatrist, there are still concerns as to your wellbeing, or concerns that you are ill, you will be sent to the mental hospital for a proper assesment. Until this assessment has been completed, YOU WILL NOT BE ALLOWED TO LEAVE. [And maybe not for a very long while after...........]

Believe me and trust me on this....

On a lighter note, these "freeman" idiots; There is not ONE recorded case anywhere in the world [not just britain] where these halfwits have EVER won a legal action or defended one sucessfully, not ONE.....

john.....

 
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