Wiring 6 spotlights

[TeeWillz]

Hi Guys,

I want to wire up 6 spotlights (2 rows of 3) in the bedroom from one main lighting point which is already wired in and wanted to confirm a few things first as I have never wired up spotlights before only normal 1,2 way lighting.

I have not checked yet but I should be able to get access to the above ceiling from the attic.

1. Would it best to use a junction box to connect the main power source already installed then feed out to the other 6 spots? (or transformer to each light and daisy chain off)

2. Also am I ok with a 20a JB or would you recommend 30a? Should I use a 6 way JB?

3. I plan on also changing the normal light switch to a dimmer switch to control the 6 spots together, do I need to wire anythign back to the switch i.e. switch wires etc?

Many Thanks for your help.

 

[Doc Hudson]

Hello Teewillz, welcome to the forum. You will do doubt require access above the lights otherwise you will no be able to get your cables to them. Are these surface or recessed spot lamps? If they are recessed you will need to check ventilation and ceiling joist positions as well. What rating are the lamps, this will have consequences regarding the rating of the dimmer switch?

Doc H.

 

[TeeWillz]

Hi Doc,

Thanks for the reply.

Sorry these will be recessed spotlights, not managed to pick up the lights yet wasn't sure whether to gofor th low 12v or something a little higher, what would you recommend?

Also, sorry if it's a silly question but upon using an JB am I ok to fix to one of the joists?

Thanks

 

[Doc Hudson]

Recommendation is difficult without knowing budget. Cheaper fittings often have problems with failures due to bad connections, (12v push type fittings), or transformers burning out, or not being dimmable. Cheap mains lamps can blow dimmers electronics when a lamp goes. Many of our members prefer good quality mains lamp mounted in a fire retardant fitting. Type & location of junction boxes is dependent upon your actual cable arrangements, but they should still be accessible unless you use maintenance free type of junction box. Probably best to keep checking back later to give chance for more of our members to log on and get their input.

Doc H.

 

[kme]

Would concur with Doc, 100% - decent fire-rated mains GU10 ( maybe the low energy variant if you`re being energy-concious; though you must ensure you get "dimmerable" ones; and the correct type of dimmer for CFL lamps).

LEDs are also available, and recently dimmerable ones have begun to appear, but they are expesive at the moment.

Again, really need to know budget, etc.........

KME

 

[TeeWillz]

Thanks for the input guys, I will get more info and come back to you.

Although I am actually fitting these for my GF's dad and he usually likes the expensive things in life, having all the house revamped. As his not long had the lounge done with 12 spotlights (I think there 240v) split into 2 rows of 6 controlled by one 2 way dimmer switch, each dimmer controlling 6 lights. So I would imagine the same spec, but I will clarify and revert back.

Cheers

 

[Robojin]

I want to wire up 6 spotlights (2 rows of 3) in the bedroom from one main lighting point which is already wired in and wanted to confirm a few things first as I have never wired up spotlights before only normal 1,2 way lighting.

Planning is everything, before you cut any holes ensure that you are at least >50mm from any joist or follow the manufactures recommendations (I have seen many cut into the joist :red card because it was in the way), is there loft insulation in place?, you will need to take this into account, some of the newer DL's are being redesigned so as to allow the lamp to vent, meet 60min burn through, and throw 95% heat downwards (good articles in this month's Professional Electrician <- pick up from wholesalers). If the ceiling has larth in place you may need to install some form of additional barrier to heat

I have not checked yet but I should be able to get access to the above ceiling from the attic.

That would help

1. Would it best to use a junction box to connect the main power source already installed then feed out to the other 6 spots? (or transformer to each light and daisy chain off)

Running from the existing rose point would save you time, you should be using maintenance free connections, take a look at the Wago range of push fits, terminating in either a Wago box, choc box or patrice+blank plate. Not a fan of transformers never seem to last long, I'd stick to 230v

2. Also am I ok with a 20a JB or would you recommend 30a? Should I use a 6 way JB?

as above install a maintenance free solution, lighting is 6A a 30A may be over zealous but your choice as the installer.

You should be checking the overall current loading (other lamps) on that circuit before you add potentially another 300w (6x50w), as a rule of thumb 1000W max per 6A circuit

3. I plan on also changing the normal light switch to a dimmer switch to control the 6 spots together, do I need to wire anythign back to the switch i.e. switch wires etc?

Unless you wish to separate the switching to a dual dimmer with 3 on 3 no, but your single dimmer must handle 300w of loading, even if you intend to use 35w or 5w LED, you must assume that these could be changed for 50w at some point and design accordingly

 

[batty]

Fitting some downlights comes under building control and therefore is notifiable to council.

 

[initforthemoney]

Yep down lights are notifiable.

Plus there is no need to use a maintenance free JB. A standard 20A 4T is perfect for the job.

And dont use the existing rose. Thats just nasty.

 

[Andy™]

Yep down lights are notifiable.

not in this case. bedroom is not a special location, so only ELV need notified, unless they are pre-assembled kits marked CE. and it would appear OP is using mains voltage anyway

 

[Robojin]

OK my wording on the Rose could have been clearer 'replace accordingly', but I was commenting, not a blow by blow instruction manual

Just think Wagos are an easier solution, maintenance free makes sense, but all down to the installer of course

Lights added to an existing circuit in a Bedroom are not notifiable

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

[quote name='Andy

 

[kme]

Mains (more dangerous 230v) is OK

but..

ELV (safer 12v) needs special notification!!!!!

tis the ole current issues on the ELV side of the cables that are the issue

if not using a Pre-assembled kit.

50w= 230v X 0.217A (per 50W bulb) - 6 of `em = 1.3A

50w= 12v X 4.166A (per 50W bulb) - 6 of `em = 25A

And they wonder why we recoil in horror when they`re wired in poxy flexes ("Oh, they`re only 12V") headbang

Nearly 20x the current flows in the secondary!!!

GuinnessGuinness

Just felt that needed real definition mate - I think it is part of the reason that rule is there....

How many (hands up) have seen burnt out connectors feeding GU10s?

Now how many have seen burnt out GX5.3s?

See? proves the point, doesn`t it?

KME

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

Just felt that needed real definition mate - I think it is part of the reason that rule is there....How many (hands up) have seen burnt out connectors feeding GU10s?

Now how many have seen burnt out GX5.3s?

See? proves the point, doesn`t it?

KME

Show off!!!

I could never do X6 numbers....

never got that far at maths in skool!

 

[Apache]

Show off!!!I could never do X6 numbers....

never got that far at maths in skool!

Admin links to a free online calculator for simpletons such as yourself

http://www.talk.electricianforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=10106

 

[Theorysparky]

Just a thought

6 downlights in a bedroom on one dimmer ???

if you could get another cable to the switch i would split them 2/4

nice touch for over the bed

 

[tom1]

Just a thought6 downlights in a bedroom on one dimmer ???

if you could get another cable to the switch i would split them 2/4

nice touch for over the bed

i used a varilight 1000w dimmer for 14 gu10.

i think they do a 600w also

 

[VoltzElectrical]

don't bother with 230v GU10's. EVER. they burn through lamps for a pass time. It's ELV all the way. trust me, i've installed more of these than most (Multiple large contracts) and the 'guaranteed lamp time' specified is a joke. make sure you get a dimmable electronic transformer for about a fiver a throw, and don't exceed the wattage on the dimmer. you'll never look back. 6 x 50w lamps = 300 w. Get a 400w dimmer and you'll be fine.

 

[batty]

don't bother with 230v GU10's. EVER. they burn through lamps for a pass time. It's ELV all the way. trust me, i've installed more of these than most (Multiple large contracts) and the 'guaranteed lamp time' specified is a joke. make sure you get a dimmable electronic transformer for about a fiver a throw, and don't exceed the wattage on the dimmer. you'll never look back. 6 x 50w lamps = 300 w. Get a 400w dimmer and you'll be fine.

I would agree with this ok you can have problems with lampholders but its generally cheap fittings or problems with insulation but if you use alutech lamps you generally will not have problems. I am moving over to low energy stuff more these days though although still fit lv in bathrooms etc or if customer specs them but generally use snaplite as these are designed to be fitted in insulation with no problems.

 

[Badger]

im going to say this and hope i dont get shot down in flames, for it, it sounds like your not an electrician, and therefore, my advice to you would be, if you arnt a trained spark, and are having to ask something quite basic, like this then you dont appear to have the knowledge to be able to carry out this work, my advice is get 3 quotes from local sparks and employ a qualified sparky to do this work, this is because they can use the testing procedures to make sure the new wiring and the existing wiring is installed safely and is earthed as it should be etc,