Assessment

[moose man]

HI All 

not been on for a while 

just looking for some advise as you know i work for a engineering pressing company

As a maintenance electrician and mechanical

cover all expects of work within the site

There insurance company at present have ask for prove of competence

this is the first time this as been requested as previous  they were happy with prove off my qualifications

and certs  i had completed on new plant installed

so  they  have decided to go with nappit full scope with company  paying for

this is the first time i will be part of this time of scheme 

so dont know what to expect as only carrying out work within the company

any advise on assessment and paper work required

thanks moose man    

 

[Andy™]

apart from the fact you will be doing all the work within the company and not for customers, everything else will be the same, i.e you will still need EIC& MWC for work done, all work done to 7671 etc. but on the plus side, there wont be anything to notify for part p

but if you dont work for customers and its only work in the company's buildings, then going napit / others seems a complete waste of time / money. your company should be telling the insurance co that you are qualified, copy of the certs and thats all they are getting

 

[Evans Electric]

I guess that you will become the Qualifying Manager for the sake of the scheme .

The company will deal with insurances etc. 

I 'll give you the ELECSA requirements  for Part P  ( Which doesn't apply to you)

Copy of latest Regs .

Electricity at Work Regulations 1989.

Building Regs Part P Doc.  (Doesn't apply)

Written H&S Document .

Risk assessments

Provision of quotes ( Non Applic)

A suitible system to control documentation.

Suitable test instruments     Loop Imp.    Megger 500v insl.  RCD tester

Calibration certs for the above .

A Complaints log   ( :C )

Your C&Gs  etc

A C&Gs  to cover the 17th edit.Regs  .

Public Liability insurance.

Site based assessment   ( Open up fuseboards , looking for loose locknuts  etc )

Install  Certificates  for the works carried out .

Inspection , testing , certification & reporting knowledge and experience.

Something you may want to check out ....many insurance companies only accept NICEIC membership  ( Because they used to be to only ones)

If you hold the basic C&Gs  & the cheque has been cashed ....you'll have no problem.

 

[NozSpark]

Well I got in didn't I .....

You will probably need regs books for all the types of work that you carry out,, obviously 7671, maybe fire alarm, em lighting, machinery, etc, etc....

 

[moose man]

thanks all for response i got latest regs with spelling mistakes  ect 

and  just done  amd 3 update course will Electricity at Work Regulations 1989.be ok on a tablet or do they need to see hard copy 

certs no problem as completed minor and installation certs on boards  and sockets i have replaced to rcd 

all meters have just been calibrated the h&s policy would the works one be ok or would it be have to be specific to work i carry out 

as for a A suitable system to control documentation.will a method statement be ok 

thanks again for replys

o one more thing got kenco coffee and cadbury biscuits 

 

[Sidewinder]

Just show the inspector all machinery works outside the scope of BS7671 when he comes blow his mind and get him to write to your insurance company explaining that they are bunch of muppets who have no idea what is required.

Freaking pilchards.

There is NO reason for your company to register with a scam for your own work.

For starters, scam registration (all scams) only assess work to BS7671 done at your customers premises.

If you are only doing your own work, then there is NO requirement for a scam membership.

How can a scam assess you on customer works when you have none?

 

[Evans Electric]

Its pure insurance reasons Sides .   Although I agree that their own sparks should be acceptable .

This is the world we live in now ........like no legal requirment to do PAT testing but ,  you need to prove you've taken reasonable steps to inspect the portable equipment ........so PAT testing it is .

The printers I've looked after for 20 odd years  were approached about two years ago to supply test certs of the whole installation ....carried out by an NICEIC company ,  I was not accepable . 

It needed a phone call from ELECSA to explain that their records were old and did not include the newer scams .  

 

[Sidewinder]

The trouble is Deke, & I know quite a bit about the way insurance companies work, because I have a very good contact in the insurance industry, is that they suffer from the "a little knowledge" syndrome.

They assume that all electrical works come under BS7671, but they don't, so they need to be put right.

As far as PAT goes, no it is not a legal requirement, never has been, however, the legal requirement is enshrined in EAWR89.

PAT is one, way to demonstrate this.

There is no way that scam membership can prove competence for machinery works as they are not assessed, ergo, scam membership does not cover the requirements of EAWR in that scenario.

However, the insurance company don't understand the difference, so, they must be educated.

I was forced to wear a hi-viz & a hard hat over the last few days, when working on a site where total site access is controlled to "permitted visitors" I was working in a sub divided section of the site totally fenced off.

No other contractors, no other works going on, no reasons could be given for the PPE requirements over and above, because the boss says so.

So it's PPE for PPE's sake, and that is WRONG, it goes against everything that HSE are pushing for.

As it happens, the hard hat was handy to keep the sun out of my eyes, and the hi-vis was not too much of a hindrance, and in fact the hi-viz bomber jacket kept me warm today.

My issue was that they could not demonstrate a risk assessment that required these controls to keep me safe, so why are they there?

This goes totally against the requirements of managing safety correctly and proportionately.

The thing is with the insurance industry is that they are a money making business, who are able to make these demands on business, without understanding the requirements of what they are demanding, what the benefits of these are, or what they entail.

They are just a bunch of idiots tbh.

I tend to try to educate IOSH members on electrical safety as much as I can, and these are the people who are the H&S bods on sites, and trust me they have NO blinking clue, most of them.

 

[moose man]

Just show the inspector all machinery works outside the scope of BS7671 when he comes blow his mind and get him to write to your insurance company explaining that they are bunch of muppets who have no idea what is required.

Freaking pilchards.

There is NO reason for your company to register with a scam for your own work.

For starters, scam registration (all scams) only assess work to BS7671 done at your customers premises.

If you are only doing your own work, then there is NO requirement for a scam membership.

How can a scam assess you on customer works when you have none?

HI Sides i agree on what you are saying i  did try to tell the insurance company adviser that i been accepted before with proof of certs

i said more a less the same words as you say  but he kept saying that some insurance company's don't except just certs in front of my boss

all so there no need to spend £500 INC VAT

On a scheme to prove competence  but they was going on what they were being advised