Chinese Co Alarms?

[ProDave]

New rules up here means from December all rental properties must have CO alarms if there are gas oil or solid fuel appliances.

So I'm getting a lot to fit already as properties change tenants in advance of the new rules. this number is only going to increase.

For the few I have done so far I have managed to source them for £20 on ebay. But none that cheap at the moment.

Many of them are over £40 a go and I just don't think the average landlord is going to accept that (plus fitting of course).

I'm toying with the idea of buying a few of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mains-Power-Carbon-Monoxide-CO-Gas-Alarm-Sensor-Warning-Detector-Alert-Monitor-/380701589786?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item58a395411a

£13.13 each at the moment.

It usually takes 2-3 weeks for this sort of cheap stuff to arrive direct from China, so no good to buy per job but I might take a punt on 10 of them.

Thoughts?

 

[Sidewinder]

Personally, I would not touch them with someone else's barge pole.

I would be looking to UK sourced named brands from my local wholesaler, and stuff the cost to the Landlord, if they don't like it, stuff them.

Are you willing to stake your life on them?

Will your insurance cover you to specify and fit them?

What if they fail and the whole family is killed, could you live with yourself?

I know I could not.

The choice is yours, this opinion is mine.

 

[Evans Electric]

I'd want to see the British Standards  marking on those TBH  Dave  ,  carbon monoxide is a deadly killer , and as we all know.....buy cheap... get crap . 

You should get a discount if you buy 10  of a known , trusted brand  TBH   .  Don't go there Dave .

 

[Phoenix]

If the landlord is going to quibble over paying £40 for a CO alarm to keep their tenant safe and meet their legal duties, then s** them. Not sure I'd be taking the risk of fitting something imported from the east which may be of inferior quality to save them £23.61 (The aico Ei225En can be had from: http://www.alertelectrical.com/prodvar/4719/aico-ei225en-mains-powered-co-alarm?&utm_source=google-base&utm_medium=web&utm_campaign=google-base-feed&gclid=CPGBqsD8lMYCFYzMtAodfg4AvQ for 36.74 including the VAT)

You'd only need a few of the cheap chinese ones to start beeping randomly causing you to have to return and swap (and good luck sending the failed ones back to the supplier!) for the difference to be eaten up anyway...!

EDIT: SW can obviously type quicker!

 

[kerching]

I was looking at the Aico stuff at Elex.....nice stuff. Did not ask the price.

I am a confirmed Aico Man

....and the new wireless module is brilliant.....don,t think it is actually released until,next week

Just saying

 

[ProDave]

That's me told then.

Okay stump up the price.

Next question, why are HEAT detectors so much more expensive than a smoke detector? they are way simpler to make.

 

[Phoenix]

That's me told then.

Okay stump up the price.

Next question, why are HEAT detectors so much more expensive than a smoke detector? they are way simpler to make.

Perhaps because they sell less I guess, so

- the price is more likely to be moaned about but paid anyway

- they have to re-coup the tooling costs etc despite selling less

- they are greedy sods

 

[Murdoch]

Hum...... Who exactly is going to publicise this and later police it???

 

[Blue Duck]

The A team!

 

[binky]

like all things these days, it will get policed when someone dies :shakehead

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

In England and Wales there is a new bylaw coming in (its down to each council to implement, some already have) that says landlords have to register every property. I thinks it ranges from about £300-500 per property for 3 years (don't quote me on that). Some of the many good points are there has to be  a valid EICR to get the 'licence'  . Smoke alarms have to be fitted but I have not read that  Co alarms do.  

My local council, Enfield, are the only ones not to set a date yet as a local business man who has hundreds of properties has taken this to the high court as he claims its an illegal practice, Council owned properties are exempt from this.

 

[ProDave]

Landlord registration in Scotland has been compulsory for a number of years, but it's a modest fee every 5 years and not much paperwork. The letting agents must also be registered.

So I guess it is them as part of the registration process that will expect to see the paperwork.

 

[Murdoch]

Can anyone put up a link that explains all this to the public?

I've got loads of landlords on my books and some of them need quite a lot of convincing to spend money!

Thanks

 

[pewter]

I love it when landlords tell me they can't afford things for there properties.

'I own s few properties so money is tight now'

Is a great line I hear sometimes

 

[apprentice87]

I agree with Sidewinder,

If you supply and fit them, you are the one that is going to be held TOTALLY responsible if they turn out not to work. I would only fit stuff that is marked with whatever the BS standard is, whether the customer supplied it or not, as, if the customer supplies chinese crap, and you fit it, some judge is liable to say that you are the professional, and, therefore, should have known better. If you took your car to a garage and instructed them to fill your brake master cylinder with fairy liquid, and then you crash, they are obviously going to be held mostly liable for obvious reasons. Same applies with these alarms i should think....

john...

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

Can anyone put up a link that explains all this to the public?

I've got loads of landlords on my books and some of them need quite a lot of convincing to spend money!

Thanks

Just had a Google and cant find much, here is the consultation from my local authority but each can differ

http://www.enfield.gov.uk/info/867/current_consultations/2718/licensing_private_rented_housing_to_tackle_asb

 

[ProDave]

Can anyone put up a link that explains all this to the public?

I've got loads of landlords on my books and some of them need quite a lot of convincing to spend money!

Thanks

Here's the Scottish version.   http://www.landlords.org.uk/news-campaigns/news/mandatory-electrical-check-requirements-december-2015

there are some anomalies:

the guidance linked from that page says:

"An EICR must be completed by a suitably competent person. Competent person means a skilled person (electrically) as defined in amendment 3 of BS7671. this means that they must be employed by a firm that is a member of an accredited registration scheme operated by a recognised body.  In Scotland this will usually mean that they are registered with NICEIC or a member firm of the electrical contractors association of Scotland (SELECT)"

Now there are a few issues with that statement.

Firstly BS7671 has never specified that you need to be a member of a competent persons scheme in order to be competent to install or test electrical installations.

And secondly Amendment 3 of BS7671 2008 has in fact deleted the term "competent person" anyway.

So although I am not a member of a competent persons scheme I am going to continue, as I meet the definition of a "skilled person" in amendment 3,  and BS7671 does not require you to be a member of a competent persons scheme. I would like to see a court argue otherwise.

 

[apprentice87]

Exactly...

john..

 

[kerching]

Many years ago somebody I know was selling the 'multi function' ladders on Ebay. Customer asked if they were CE marked. He checked with the factory in China. Not presently CE marked....but if you want them CE marking it will cost another 2p per ladder

This was to cover the cost of printing the sticker and getting a Technician Engineer to apply the sticker

Just saying

 

[ProDave]

The trouble with china is a BS mark, CE mark or any other mark is worthless as they just stamp them but nothings tested

[devils advocate]

We can only go by manufacturers literature.  If a Chinese one bears all the correct markings, who are we to judge that we don't believe they have actually been tested.

What would a court of law actually say as long as the device fitted was claimed by the manufacturer to comply?

[/devils advocate]