Eicr

[Russ1109]

Hi,

Just wondered if anyone knows what the going rate for an ECIR is in the North.

Got beat on price of a 3 bedroom house.I put price in of £150 which i think is ok.Some will prob say its cheap.

Emailed the guy today to see if quote was any good to him and was told it was a little high.I asked him out of interest and was told it was being done for £85.

I don't think he'll being doing a thorough check for that. He can't be surely.He'll prob fail it on a few things and bang the extras in,make a bit extra on those bits.

Would like to know other peoples thoughts on this.Anybody else had similar thing?

Cheers guys

 

[Sidewinder]

Both prices too low, lowest, just stupid!

Not being nasty, but this is a major problem with the industry, prices are just too low to be tenable for competent work to be undertaken.

 

[steptoe]

north being where?

 

[M107]

Agree with Sidey, no matter north or south both prices are stupidly low.

 

[kme]

:slap

You get what you pay for - £ 150 to me would get you an unoccupied, 3 bed terrace with no more than 6 final ccts - and that would be a "mates rates" type price.

EICRs are important. They take time to do properly ; and the cost MUST reflect that. If the customer wants to pay for a "drive-by" - that`s their lookout. Don`t lower yourself, just to secure cheap work. 

 

[Theorysparky]

It depends what you are doing for £150

That's what I have to charge in the midlands to get the job

make it up on the remedials  and cu upgrade as and when

I do agree it is low but its the industry

 

[Sharpend]

The trouble here is that whilst we as electricians see the EICR as an important piece of information if carried out correctly, the rest of the world doesn't.

It's as important as an MOT, so why is every electrician permitted to do them? Why not have a system similar to the MOT registered mechanics?

 

[ProDave]

The difference is WE see them as a comprehensive test.

The customer sees it as an inconvenient bit of paper that somebody else has asked for, so they just want a "pass" as cheap as possible. See the reaction you get when you give them an "unsatisfactory" eicr.

That's not the way it should be, but that's how it is in the real world.

 

[Blue Duck]

The trouble here is that whilst we as electricians see the EICR as an important piece of information if carried out correctly, the rest of the world doesn't.

It's as important as an MOT, so why is every electrician permitted to do them? Why not have a system similar to the MOT registered mechanics?

This as I see it is a big problem with our industry, there is little or no awareness of the importance of testing an electrical system and the scams and other so called charities do sweet fa about it until someone dies and Tony cable pops on on this morning.

I have an ongoing issue with a customer trying to get me in the poop over an eicr (why didnt they just keep it pir) where I stated that I would inspect & test sockets, kitchen, lighting, earthing and fuse board. The customer seems to think we had agreed to everything which at 4.30pm on a Friday wasn't going to happen Then on the Monday my boss gets an angry email full of the usual moan moan this service is carp etc. but she clearly states that her electrics haven't been tested in 27 years!!! why? Why now? Why me? FFS!

I would say that 95% of my customers have no Idea what an RCD is, the few that do remember the campaign from back in the 90's or have had a belt off a faulty appliance.

The scams need to at least promote the reasons for having electrical installations checked rather than jus raping us for money, selling tools, hoodies and BS online courses.

Anyone tried the ESC app?

Just ranting....

 

[davetheglitz]

Contoversial - but the only way to be 100% sure etc in an inspection is to test everything - which is all sockets all lights floorboards up, knowing the routing of concealed wires etc. Cheaper to rip out and start again.

A high percentage of the system can be hit quickly at the CU with continuity/insulation/RCD/Bonding/Earthing. Remaining circuits Zs can be easy - though always a guess/compromise on the end of line with lighting. I don't test every light. A Zs check on all sockets and visual on accessories and exposed wiring is not that time consuming. For a 3/4 bed house I reckon on 2.5/3hours testing with 45-60 write up. £100 max. This is with results sheet correctly filled out and sufficient tests to give a high degree of confidence in the system. Also no inflation of C3 to C2 and C2 to C1 which seems to be the way of things down here.  What am I missing out?

 

[steptoe]

Ive just done an EICR on a week old rewire and it failed,! :slap

 

[Blue Duck]

Ive just done an EICR on a week old rewire and it failed,! :slap

Was this your lady friend? georgeP?

5ww rewire?

 

[Steve3948]

Contoversial - but the only way to be 100% sure etc in an inspection is to test everything - which is all sockets all lights floorboards up, knowing the routing of concealed wires etc. Cheaper to rip out and start again.

A high percentage of the system can be hit quickly at the CU with continuity/insulation/RCD/Bonding/Earthing. Remaining circuits Zs can be easy - though always a guess/compromise on the end of line with lighting. I don't test every light. A Zs check on all sockets and visual on accessories and exposed wiring is not that time consuming. For a 3/4 bed house I reckon on 2.5/3hours testing with 45-60 write up. £100 max. This is with results sheet correctly filled out and sufficient tests to give a high degree of confidence in the system. Also no inflation of C3 to C2 and C2 to C1 which seems to be the way of things down here.  What am I missing out?

Dave so 4 Hours, that's £25 per hour = £100.00

So what about getting there transport, fuel etc etc,

What about test equipment, purchase and calibration.

What about software and certificate costs, paper, inks, printer etc etc.

What about tools to do the job, all need to be costed in.

What about your office expenses and fees to accountant etc.

My bank told me 30 years ago, whatever your cost double it and you will stay in business.

Anyone charging £100 will not be around long, trust me I've met dozens that think they are making money - False - no longer trading.

 

[SLIPSHOD & SLAPDASH]

99.5% of these cheap EICR are in fact a Landlords Visual report or  a EICR where the 'inspector'  only moved between the door and the distribution board and its full of LIM's. I know of a large testing company where all there commercial EICR have actually had no testing done.

 

[davetheglitz]

Dave so 4 Hours, that's £25 per hour = £100.00

So what about getting there transport, fuel etc etc,

What about test equipment, purchase and calibration.

What about software and certificate costs, paper, inks, printer etc etc.

What about tools to do the job, all need to be costed in.

What about your office expenses and fees to accountant etc.

My bank told me 30 years ago, whatever your cost double it and you will stay in business.

Anyone charging £100 will not be around long, trust me I've met dozens that think they are making money - False - no longer trading.

Yes - food for thought there - but I like to keep my costings simple. I like to get £25 on hour for honest work - which is pretty good round these parts.

If I was employed I would be expected to get to my place of employment - not included within my tax allowances. As a self employed electrician it is. Test equipment and tools - a necessity to the job - but most last for years so not overly significant on a per job basis. Office expenses - what office? Accountant - unnecessary parasite! Software - free. Paper inks printer - £40 Epson with refillable inks £5.00 a ream of paper - however most done electronically.

It's a balance.

To some extent EICR's can be viewed as a loss leader. Many will lead on to further work. Howerer this is taken to extremes by some and I've seen some shockers recently!

 

[Blue Duck]

Wasn't there a recent post about a job where they were offering £25 per house?

20 houses in a day.

Job done.

 

[pewter]

most 3-4 bedroom houses (occupied) i see could not be tested correctly in 4 hours. ( if treating the clients house and possessions with respect)

Its not a race

 

[davetheglitz]

most 3-4 bedroom houses (occupied) i see could not be tested correctly in 4 hours. ( if treating the clients house and possessions with respect)

Its not a race

Delivering value at a fair price - arguably it is a race!  If the house and CU are in good condition then 4 hours is certainly feasible.

What is your definition of properly?

100% testing is the only proper test - and even then problems can be created by re-installing.

So 50%? 10%? Check consealed cables? Go in the loft? It's about a reasonable degree of confidence that all is safe.

A very high degree of confidence can be gained within 4 hours if you work consistently - and you can do that with respect thank you very much as that doesn't cost anything!

 

[pewter]

Contoversial - but the only way to be 100% sure etc in an inspection is to test everything - which is all sockets all lights floorboards up, knowing the routing of concealed wires etc. Cheaper to rip out and start again.

A high percentage of the system can be hit quickly at the CU with continuity/insulation/RCD/Bonding/Earthing. Remaining circuits Zs can be easy - though always a guess/compromise on the end of line with lighting. I don't test every light. A Zs check on all sockets and visual on accessories and exposed wiring is not that time consuming. For a 3/4 bed house I reckon on 2.5/3hours testing with 45-60 write up. £100 max. This is with results sheet correctly filled out and sufficient tests to give a high degree of confidence in the system. Also no inflation of C3 to C2 and C2 to C1 which seems to be the way of things down here.  What am I missing out?

i must be too slow and expensive then.

I like to check rings circuit continuity and R1+R2 circuits. From your description i think i might be a lot more thorough. If i am testing a circuit i will get the result however long it takes, i dont compromise to race against the clock.

8-10 circuits    30-40 mins per circuit is getting over 4 hours without the paperwork.

for me it can take a while sometimes to move furniture, wait for customer to move items, dogs, children etc. Other day it took me 15 mins to move a fridge so i could unplug it from a circuit.

sometimes replacing one accessory can take a while due to location, state of how it was originally installed , correcting things along the way like sleeving, exposed conductor, twisted wires.

some places have complicated light fittings throughout the entire house.

So to earn your days money would you book 2 in one day?

what if the first takes longer?   do you then get to the 2nd late? or do it another day?

you say 3 hours to test, if 9 circuits then 20 mins to test each circuit.

Even if you do complete one in 4 hours, time to travel to the next job does not leave a lot of time left in the day.

Delivering value at a fair price - arguably it is a race!  If the house and CU are in good condition then 4 hours is certainly feasible.

What is your definition of properly?

100% testing is the only proper test - and even then problems can be created by re-installing.

So 50%? 10%? Check consealed cables? Go in the loft? It's about a reasonable degree of confidence that all is safe.

A very high degree of confidence can be gained within 4 hours if you work consistently - and you can do that with respect thank you very much as that doesn't cost anything!

Taking care and and respecting someones property can cost time, a lot of time.

You can keep the £100 customers,   I will stick to the ones paying £200-300

 

[davetheglitz]

So seriously - if you've got all chandeliers in the house do you take them all off? Multiple downlights - do you check them all to find last point for R1+R2 and risk damaging the ceiling? If you've got 3 lighting cables coming into an MCB do you find the last point for each leg? I can see where the costs come in! Any testing will involve a degree of sampling - I suspect that is where we differ.

If you are getting business at 200-300 then credit to you. Down here I would not.

Writing up is done at home - so if on site work takes longer I still have enough time to do another. Also I charge by the hour - not a fixed rate - so if there are problems I still get paid for my time.