septiclecky
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Glad I won't be sailing with you, you'll aim for the Shetlands and end up in the Falklands.
Garage Wiring
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Ok. Does it state in the regs anywhere how little constitutes a new circuit? I'm not being a pain, just curious.
As a householder I understood I could:
- change the protective device
- add to an existing circuit
What If I want a different cable so I remove the existing directly from the MCB and fit a different cable immediately? Has it just become a new circuit (because I don't think it has). What if I remove the immersion heater, disconnect the cable and then want to put in the shed supply 6 months later? Has this now become a new circuit when it wasn't before?
Are we saying if there is a sheet of test results then so long as the number of circuits now = the number then it's all OK?
The exact point may not be very important to you guys, but it could be to guys like me! Perhaps it is best left vague!
If you have a redundant immersion circuit, and install a garage circuit you will have a new circuit.
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But will you? Even if I used the same breaker and connected the wires to the garage where the immersion circuit was cut off?
as Special says, a circuit is an assembly of equipment...
so a spare MCB isnt really a circuit, i would say a circuit would have as a minimum 1 accessory, even if its a socket below the board fed in a bit of 2.5 (or 1.5 depending on MCB)
as for adding to an immersion circuit, immersion heaters require their own circuit, so you couldnt add to that if its still used for that, but if the heater has been removed then you could add to it. but if you do that with the intention of removing the old and only connecting the new, then you have effectively added a new circuit, you have simply just re-used the MCB. if you keep the old wiring then you have added to it. even if you decide an hour later that you dont want the old immersion circuit and disconnect it...
so, perfectly clear... connect the new, then remove the old!
Andy,
I think this is what Patch is getting at.
If there is already something there then it's a modification rather than a new circuit.
Kind of, could you get away with an MWC, if so, it's not a new Cct, else it would need an EIC.
I think this is what Patch is getting at.
If there is already something there then it's a modification rather than a new circuit.
Kind of, could you get away with an MWC, if so, it's not a new Cct, else it would need an EIC.
Let's put it this way...
If you have a spare 16A MCB and connect a bit of cable from it to a socket then that would be a new circuit and require an EIC
If however you connected the same cable to the same MCB that supplies something else then that's an addition/alteration to a circuit and you could probably get away with a MWC
If you have a spare 16A MCB and connect a bit of cable from it to a socket then that would be a new circuit and require an EIC
If however you connected the same cable to the same MCB that supplies something else then that's an addition/alteration to a circuit and you could probably get away with a MWC
great planning, isnt it. but those in charge know what they are doing, so they must be right...
Doc Hudson
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Regulations 521.8.1 thro 521.8.3 and 314.1 thro 314.4 give many references to final circuits and their arrangements, distribution, separation etc. 314.4 refers to circuits being connected to separate ways in a distribution board, implying that circuits are not MCB's. 521.x.x refers to the parts of the circuits having conductors or cores of a cable, again implying that without cables and a load there is no circuit. It also follows logically that if all of the constituent parts of an original circuit are no longer there it is no longer an existing circuit, it would be a new circuit. Suggesting you can replace the cable accessories and load connected to an existing MCB an still call it an existing circuit is verging into the realms realms of Triggers broom from Fools & Horses, it was still the original broom, just had numerous new handles and numerous new heads!.
Doc H.
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Yes Doc,
I think this is another thing Patch is getting at.
Just trying to bend the rules as far as can be done.
The issue is at which point do they break, rather than bend?
I think this is another thing Patch is getting at.
Just trying to bend the rules as far as can be done.
The issue is at which point do they break, rather than bend?
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
Well that's like saying if you start with a miniature white horse with black spots on and you join the dots you get a zebra? Leave it alone!
so,
you have a redundant immersion circuit,
you connect your garage to the MCB, its a spur off an existing circuit,
no notification required,
then, you disconnect your immersion circuit, you dont need to notify disconnecting a circuit,
its a ******* joke.!!!!!!!!!!
but, they make the rules, so, it must be OK....
you have a redundant immersion circuit,
you connect your garage to the MCB, its a spur off an existing circuit,
no notification required,
then, you disconnect your immersion circuit, you dont need to notify disconnecting a circuit,
its a ******* joke.!!!!!!!!!!
but, they make the rules, so, it must be OK....
davetheglitz
Electrician
It's an absolute farce. The amount of information building control receive from the scam providers tells them noting of any value and I suspect it goes straight in the bin.
I'd be more concerned on the safety aspect -correct cable, RCD, insulation and earthing and earthing/bonding arrangement if there is extraneous metalwork and the garage is detached.
I'd be more concerned on the safety aspect -correct cable, RCD, insulation and earthing and earthing/bonding arrangement if there is extraneous metalwork and the garage is detached.
I too share your reservations and these things dont't get thought about if its a DIYer, Joe from the pub or Bob the builder doing the work.
pewter
Conspiracy Theorist™
It does not matter if you create a new circuit or connect to an existing, it is still notifiable.
Approved document Part-P amendment 2013, section 2, 2.2 a (ii)
Part-P applies to - outbuildings such as sheds, detached garages and domestic green houses.
In the pocket guide it also states garages been notifiable.
http://niceic.com/en/account/media/17thpg8.pdf
Approved document Part-P amendment 2013, section 2, 2.2 a (ii)
Part-P applies to - outbuildings such as sheds, detached garages and domestic green houses.
In the pocket guide it also states garages been notifiable.
http://niceic.com/en/account/media/17thpg8.pdf
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Pocket Guide 31 supersedes the old PG8 for England...
Amended PG 8 is just for Wales!
Guinness
Amended PG 8 is just for Wales!
Guinness
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