Help With Light Wiring Required Please!

[5ammyboy]

So, ignoring the redundant cable, if I connect the red and earth from cable 2 and the neutral and earth from cable 3 into a junction box, should I just insulate the cut wires?

It should be pretty straight forward after this... just a case of twin and earth in and out of each downlighter then connecting the junction box into the final downlighter in the circuit. I guess the 2 gang switch on the left of my diagram will then be redundant as only one switch will be required.

Does this all sound about right?

Many thanks for everyone's help on this.

Sam.

 

[ProDave]

Best to terminate and insulate the unused wires. Just in case some future modification somewhere makes them live.

you say you are planning to install a string of downlighters without lifting the floor above. I just hope for your sake where you want to install them runs parallel to the joists.  Otherwise you have to get the wired through your joists in many places which means cutting holes in the ceiling and patching up afterwards. Not difficult but extra work.

 

[5ammyboy]

Thanks ProDave... I'll terminate and insulate then.

Unfortunately the joists run horizontally which is a pain in the backside so I'm having to go under with lots of holes like you said. I'm plastering the ceiling after I get the holes and wiring in place though as it's currently artex so it should be fine eventually.

I think I might have to reconnect the pendant to find out for sure what's happening with the wiring. Either cable 2 or 3 must be from the switch on the left. If I'm creating a series then I should be able to change that switch to a single then get rid of either cable 2 or 3 presumably.

Regards,

Sam.

 

[Evans Electric]

Just to further confuse you Sammy,  we are warned that   most  Artex contains asbestos  and is best left undisturbed .  When you drill it for downlights you'll create a lot of dust .    I know you didn't want to hear this ............your ceiling may be harmless plaster but who knows  .

 

[5ammyboy]

O oh! I didn't know that.

I've already done the ceiling on the ground floor unawares! All I've done is scraped off the heads, drilled the holes and plastered. The house was only built in 1992... could the artex still have asbestos in it?

 

[Sidewinder]

It could, but that depends on when the mix batch was made.

It seems that it was disallowed from 1990 to be added to the mix, but, not sure if there was a requirement to stop using stock material that did contain Asbestos immediately, TBH I doubt it.

The only way to tell is to get samples taken, and a single sample is unfortunately not acceptable for "Artex" type coatings.

 

[Andy™]

O oh! I didn't know that.

I've already done the ceiling on the ground floor unawares! All I've done is scraped off the heads, drilled the holes and plastered. The house was only built in 1992... could the artex still have asbestos in it?

asbestos could be in anytihg built before 2000

 

[5ammyboy]

On the bright side I've saved a few bob on a plasterer and electrician... just might have lost a few years of my life!

Thanks for the info guys, much appreciated. I'll see if I can get some tested then before I start the top floor.

Kind Regards,

Sam.

 

[Sidewinder]

The sad thing is though, not just you, it could be your family, friends or anyone visiting your property until the fibres are gone.

Now a normal vacuum cleaner, is one of the worst things that you can use to clean up!

 

[5ammyboy]

Why's that then about the vacuum cleaner? I used a Henry hoover to suck it up.

What would you suggest I do now?

 

[Andy™]

a normal vacuum cannot filter asbestos. it simply blows it around and makes it even more airborne than it already was.

a little knowledge is dangerous...

 

[SPECIAL LOCATION]

just make sure the neutral is on the same circuit as the live

+1

Has this point been confirmed of not...???

I would bet that the way it is wired (2x T&E's used as singles), there is a high probability that the Live and Neutral do not come from the same circuit....

Re Asbestos...

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/

 

[5ammyboy]

Thanks again for everyone's advice on the electrics.

I'll speak to my local environmental health officer on Monday regarding the artex and potential asbestos risk.

Regards,

Sam

 

[Blue Duck]

Ohh god not this again....

Good job your a diyer and not a tradesperson!

My dads entire house was artexed (1960's). once he got rid of the lot and yes he's still going and has no known lung problems.

Let this be a lesson and do some research. I uncovered some asbestos cable and pooped my pants! ever since I have been very careful in my work to try avoid uncovering the stuff.

Good luck.



Where's technician these days?

 

[ProDave]

I have a ceiling to "renovate" that's artexed.  I was going to take it down.  I'm now more inclined to just leave it in place and over sheet with new plasterboard. Less mess, less danger.

When I was at school, asbestos was everywhere. the ceilings were lined with the stuff and there were bits with holes in. The kids used to jump up and try to enlarge the holes All the heating pipes were lagged with it as well.  Then someone woke up and after the school summer holidays the whole lot had been stripped out.

 

[Murdoch]

I wonder if the board is a dual rcd type?

 

[Sidewinder]

HSE HQ in Wales, in Cardiff is full of the stuff!

50's/60's high rise office block building.

They just leave it there undisturbed, as then it's fine.

We do work for the local Health Trust, in patients homes.

One of the things we avoid at all costs is textured wall coatings.

For one or two holes we have a legitimate work around that involves a licensed contractor.

Any more then it's a non starter.

When I was an apprentice, we used to chisel the stuff off the pipes, so far I'm OK.

However, I know there are members on here who have had close friends and acquaintances succumb to the dreaded fibre.

If you do an official course on awareness, then the facts that are presented are quite enlightening.

I did do the advanced course for "non-licensed" works, so that I knew what needed to be done, with no intentions of doing it though, so at one time I did hold a "ticket" for asbestos works.

Trouble is I don't have a carriers licence for the waste, nor am I insured to do anything with asbestos, so I let the "ticket" lapse, no point in keeping it up to date!

I am though a year out on my awareness refresher.

The law around it has changed recently, so I do really need to get up to date again.

"The silent killer"...

 

[Blue Duck]

Asbestos has been known to be a danger to health since the 1930's but no one decided to do anything about it until the 1990's.

My primary school was made out of the stuff, I remember the waring notices in every room! I left there in 1990.

I also remember falling through an asbestos roof into someone's garage!

 

[5ammyboy]

Well it's certainly caught me unawares. I bet 90% of young DIYers will drill into artex ceilings at some point not knowing about the asbestos risk. There should be a well publicised government reminder on TV or something.

I'm hoping I've escaped danger though as everywhere I'm reading is suggesting that white asbestos stopped being added to textured ceiling mixes after 1984. Our house was built in 1992. White asbestos is also supposedly the least aggressive type of asbestos and mixes only contained 3-5%. I feel slightly more comfortable having done the research but never thought in a million years that my ceiling could contain artex so I would never had known to do the research in the first place... hence why it would be a good idea for a government refresher.

 

[Evans Electric]

+1

Has this point been confirmed of not...???

I would bet that the way it is wired (2x T&E's used as singles), there is a high probability that the Live and Neutral do not come from the same circuit....

Re Asbestos...

http://www.hse.gov.uk/asbestos/

I was thinking more like the guy had no singles with him and used up his T&E .

Its impossible to know for sure but I'd have thought that ceiling patterning was done with plaster by 1990 but it best to warn Mr Sammy .