From this months PE
First bullet point - in the words of John McEnroe "you can't be serious"
First bullet point - in the words of John McEnroe "you can't be serious"
Let the revolution begin?
- Thread starter Murdoch
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as AFDDs have been proven not to work on ring mains, I would say what a load of Radishes!
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Well, being a bit picky on this sort of thing ( fecking Shytte use of our language)
it says on circuits of LESS THAN 32A so by definition does not include 32A circuits
if it said 32A and less then ring mains would be covered but a circuit less than 32A must be 31.9999 so NOT a ring main
just saying
it says on circuits of LESS THAN 32A so by definition does not include 32A circuits
if it said 32A and less then ring mains would be covered but a circuit less than 32A must be 31.9999 so NOT a ring main
just saying
Hum ........... so we have to fit AFDD's to all other circuits?
My latest rewire has 8 circuits below 32A
So who are the IDIOTS thinking up this rubbish and more importantly what is their justification?
and at these prices our customers aren't going to be very happy
https://cpc.farnell.com/wylex/gb6-nxsb32afd/32a-30ma-b-rcbo-afdd-single-mod/dp/PL16468?mckv=sjM1zEeUx_dc|pcrid|224681503328|kword||match||plid||slid||product|PL16468|pgrid|47203068935|ptaid|pla-561939048854|&CMP=KNC-GUK-CPC-SHOPPING&gclid=CjwKCAiA-f78BRBbEiwATKRRBFr0qShI8eF3oiF3zTLK1lkN8hGBP-Vz015cKruQ1QV1ah50UVrXEBoC2MEQAvD_BwE
https://cpc.farnell.com/wylex/gb6-nxsb32afd/32a-30ma-b-rcbo-afdd-single-mod/dp/PL16468?mckv=sjM1zEeUx_dc|pcrid|224681503328|kword||match||plid||slid||product|PL16468|pgrid|47203068935|ptaid|pla-561939048854|&CMP=KNC-GUK-CPC-SHOPPING&gclid=CjwKCAiA-f78BRBbEiwATKRRBFr0qShI8eF3oiF3zTLK1lkN8hGBP-Vz015cKruQ1QV1ah50UVrXEBoC2MEQAvD_BwE
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
You’ll have to sell them on the bulk buy savings 
to the customer.
to the customer. 
Interesting that the Technical specification sheet doesn't even mention AFDD characteristics. It's just in the title.
This is a new development I think from the "Electric Police" . To make it mandatory to fit AFDD s in boards is obviously instigated by the manufacturers of said pieces of junk after finding to take up and interest from the grass roots of the trade to be a resounding nil.
Doubtless the trade at grass roots will be trodden underfoot by the faceless shiny suits at the top of the pyramid representing the manufactures who thought they could increase their profits by introducing a new device that no one wants.
The cost of a new board will be astronomical at those prices and would probably result in existing boards being kept .
A story went round the trade years ago of a move afoot to abolish the traditional domestic ring main based on 13A fused sockets and replace it with 16A radials . This was exposed as a move by manufacturers to enable them to produce more powerful appliances .
I was told the union ( ETU) was instrumental partly in getting move kicked into touch .
Doubtless the trade at grass roots will be trodden underfoot by the faceless shiny suits at the top of the pyramid representing the manufactures who thought they could increase their profits by introducing a new device that no one wants.
The cost of a new board will be astronomical at those prices and would probably result in existing boards being kept .
A story went round the trade years ago of a move afoot to abolish the traditional domestic ring main based on 13A fused sockets and replace it with 16A radials . This was exposed as a move by manufacturers to enable them to produce more powerful appliances .
I was told the union ( ETU) was instrumental partly in getting move kicked into touch .
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My thoughts.
How long before 18th has been through it's consultation and actually become the current regs in force.
And how long from that date to a far more important date now less than 3 years away that I am counting down the days to?
I get the feeling I may never get the "pleasure" of doing an install with AFDD's
So at the prices above a typical domestic CU will now be over £1000. Let me guess how many customers will accept that, and how many will choose the sparky that does not suggest fitting them.
How long before 18th has been through it's consultation and actually become the current regs in force.
And how long from that date to a far more important date now less than 3 years away that I am counting down the days to?
I get the feeling I may never get the "pleasure" of doing an install with AFDD's
So at the prices above a typical domestic CU will now be over £1000. Let me guess how many customers will accept that, and how many will choose the sparky that does not suggest fitting them.
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
I don’t know why people can’t understand the grumpy old man syndrome? Maybe it’s what we do for work that makes us this way?
how many unemployed old men are grumpy? They’ve always lived the same way :C
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Life and all it throws at us makes us Grumpy. I aspire to be like Victor Meldrew. Everything he says is so spot on.
You will understand. One day.........
You will understand. One day.........
For the record, I’m not grumpy, simply fed up with the continual tinkering of the regs every 3 years, each time failing to correct issues from previous editions, errors with new regs and totally unjustifiable introduction of AFDDs
it’s not as if SPDs have been a success .... almost no sparks understand when they should be used and now sites are being given C2’s because they don’t have SPDs
what a farce
so is anybody going to offer up ANY justification for introducing AFDDs ?
it’s not as if SPDs have been a success .... almost no sparks understand when they should be used and now sites are being given C2’s because they don’t have SPDs
what a farce
so is anybody going to offer up ANY justification for introducing AFDDs ?
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
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I'm getting a picture in my head of a load of escaped slaves being questioned by the Romans .
When the Centurian demands " Which one is is Victor "?? They all cry out .....!"I am Victor ...no ! I am Victor "
When in fact ....I am Victor.
When the Centurian demands " Which one is is Victor "?? They all cry out .....!"I am Victor ...no ! I am Victor "
When in fact ....I am Victor.
Jono Pashley
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Why do you keep blithering about SPDs, they have been around and in use for decades. You being ignorant to their use is your own problem.
SPD's were introduced into BS 7671 because of information from other parts of the world - and like AFDD's they were used to try and raise the quota of changes to mean a new Amendment could be "justified".
SPD's are not mandatory and as such we have the decision to make as to whether they are required and a large part of this decision is down to the incoming supply of the property. I've just fitted my first one, due to it being a TT supply in a rural area where the supply was visible for some distance
Marketing hype from manufacturers have made people believe that SPD's are necessary on all installations - which they are not.
Then there are people giving C2's for no SPD
I've always found SPD info slightly confusing, ie exactly what level of protection do they give, eg do they also protect against mains voltage spikes. The sort you get when power staions are swithced on' off sometimes. If they offer protection against such mains spikes, they could be justified as protection for electronic equipment / household appliances.
Sharpend
"It Just Is"
Those that are fitted at source should protect from any surge I’d have thought?
Clearly CPC aren't planning on selling a lot with only 5 in stock
Never understood why they are priced to discourage people fitting them
When you look at the changes to the regs over the last few years there seems to be little or no justification for them
Because a small part of the UK saw an increase in consumer unit fires the regs told us to use non combustable CU's E.G. metal which was interpreted by most to you must use a metal consumer unit. Nobody chose to investigate or have an inquiry as to why these fires occurred or why one part of the country was affected more than any other. There are possibly hundreds of thousands of plastic consumer units still in use fitted decades ago that have suffered no adverse effects in many years of service so was the plastic consumer unit at fault or was it other influences that caused the problem
How have we survived all these years with electricity without having SPD's, exactly how often will that "lightning" strike to make them worthwhile, how many homeowners, tenant's etc test their RCD's periodically so how likely are they to check / test an SPD
Now the AFDD is the latest bit of kit to be foisted on the UK market and be rapidly written into the regs with many knowing little or nothing about it and many questioning whether it can do what it is supposed / intended to do. The biggest issue with AFDD's is how do we identify what the fault is if it trips is it the circuit wiring or is it a faulty unit. With the only method of testing currently available being the in built self test how much trust can we place in the unit
Surely they should have had some sort of consultation on AFDD's and demonstrate the absolute need for them before putting them in the draft amendment as a mandatory requirement, the biggest issue going forward is that due to the cost safety will suffer as the cost of a replacement consumer unit will become prohibitively expensive for a lot of households
